She’s one of only half a handful of Dems that sound ready to lead people into battle. The difference between how she uses knowledge and intelligence to speak to people is in stark comparison to Trump sounding exactly like he has dementia. She listens and responds. Trump just keeps interrupting any question he doesn’t like. Fuck you Maga. Fuck you entirely. You god damn idiots.
I would prefer a new party, but I’m glad that she and Bernie are still out there.
Funny what happens when you actually do something.
Disagree. The Democrats dont know who they are anymore. Pelosi and the old Democrats have got to go.
AOC should just make a new party.
No, we don’t have time for that. We just have to do a tea party on the Democratic party… Which is what she’s been doing
They do have to go, but we’re keeping the house and the dog
That’s why I never believed in the rhetoric of “it’s too late to consider 3rd party!” before the elections. Here it is just 6 months later and “we don’t have time for that”. Is it disingenuous then to just say there will never be time for that, like it is being implied here?
edit: just saw your other comments, I hope your DNC-tea party plan works with some effect. It’s harder for those who have voted for decades for a party that just isn’t responsive to the citizens so we’ll see I suppose.
That’s why I never believed in the rhetoric of “it’s too late to consider 3rd party!” before the elections. Here it is just 6 months later and “we don’t have time for that”. Is it disingenuous then to just say there will never be time for that, like it is being implied here?
It takes years to get a new party off the ground and in a meaningful position to take federal offices at any significant rate. During that time, you are mostly helping your farthest opposition of the main parties win by splitting the vote.
This is literally why the Tea Party operated by internal change of the GOP and not by starting a third party. And love them or hate them, they were effective at shifting the GOP.
My concern with this take is “what are we considering this effect to be?” If we are taking the average republican who wholly considers themselves to be “Conservative”, their party was overtaken by extremists who are the antithesis to what the goal of that meaning is.
I don’t want a “Blue Maga” which takes the party away from progressive policies in an attempt to drum up fanatical support “against the tyrannical reds” while in reality they continue destroying the democracy we have. An example is a new DNC who wishes to prosecute and deport those who are on the right (there are examples on this site of individuals who are “progressives” but think the “right” should all be rounded up).
When people say they want a “tea party” I think it’s way to vague. Talking about the “effectiveness” of how the GOP has been changed is just completely scary, since in reality it just became a mask off-authoritarian free for all. I don’t need a Corporatized DNC to decide they no longer need the decorum of piece-meal policy that helps citizens since they know everyone has no other choice (like what happened with the GOP).
Again, I really hope a “Left Tea Party” would cause the DNC to capitulate to progressive ideology, but that’s not what happened on the conservative side (as evident from the big beautiful bullshit-bill).
edit: taking=talking, fixed a confusing sentence
It takes years to get a new party off the ground and in a meaningful position to take federal offices at any significant rate.
Excuse me, but how the fuck do you know that? You say that like 3rd parties being created and taking federal offices happens all the time. We haven’t had a serious 3rd party, let alone one that takes federal office, for well over 100 years. Don’t pretend you know what it takes, because we haven’t even fucking tried. It’s uncharted water!
You say that like 3rd parties being created and taking federal offices happens all the time.
They aren’t, and that’s kinda the point. People grossly underestimate how hard it is to do this (pretending it’s some great unknown and not something that’s been tried and failed literally dozens of times), and what game theory regarding FPTP elections means for the rise of one.
We haven’t had a serious 3rd party, let alone one that takes federal office, for well over 100 years.
We had a few elected to Congress in the last hundred years, even if you don’t count ones who changed party at some point. Mostly Farmer-Labor Party between the late 20s and end of WW2. We also had a Conservative Party of New York candidate in Congress in the 70s. And a Libertarian if you do count people who convert while in office. Hell, Trump once tried to run for POTUS as a third party candidate in 2000 for the Reform Party, but failed miserably and didn’t win a single state during the primaries.
Don’t pretend you know what it takes, because we haven’t even fucking tried. It’s uncharted water!
How many parties do you think we have that are large enough they operate in multiple states and have ballot access right now? The answer is a dozen. All of which have hopes of eventually getting someone in federal office, you know aside from the Dems and GOP who already do that. Of those twelve, 9 ran a presidential candidate in 2024. You’ve probably only even heard of 4 of those at most (Harris, Trump, Stein and maybe Chase Oliver [Libertarian]).
What it takes at a minimum is getting a majority of a state or House district on board with you and willing to vote for you rather than a major party, knowing that if enough other people don’t buy in it’s going to let the candidate farthest from them win instead. If you’re pushing for POTUS, then it means getting about 78M people on board in the same way, distributed across most of the country.
Third parties running for federal office isn’t untested water, it’s just extremely difficult to succeed at. Again, that’s why the Tea Party operated as a reform movement within the GOP rather than being an actual third party - it let them hijack the political machinery of the party from within, instead of having to fight against it in a battle that would at most likely cause both to lose if it did anything at all. Literally, had the Tea Party been an actual third party then instead of gaining massive influence they would have at their most powerful caused Democrats to win by splitting the GOP vote.
It would take many decades for a new party to get the recognition.
Most voters probably think Obama is still president.
Would it though? I’m not convinced of that. We already know what the party should look and act like based on actual progressive parties and policies around the world (even some past actions in the states itself), we really just need a name to know it by for everyone to get behind.
It’s the whole problem-solution thing, doesn’t matter what the name of the website or company is, we just need something to step in and fill that gap.
You might not have noticed my point.
I think the vaaast majority of voters just vote the way they always have. They’re just not engaged. There’s no consideration of who to vote for.
I honestly think it would take either a revolution, or several decades before any other party has a chance.
Sadly many of them didn’t know Kamela was even running until they couldn’t find Biden’s name on the polls come Election Night.
The Tea Party of the Left is what we needed back in the Obama days, better late than never.
There have always been factions in the main parties. Obama was part of a wave of more progressive Democrats that pulled away from the moderate liberalism of Clinton.
There are also formal sub parties like the Blue Dog Democrats and the New Democrat Coalition, the us news media just doesn’t report on them the way European news does for parties.
Even AOC and “the squad” are considered a faction with followers and enemies. The fact that the media is focusing on her and de facto making her the face should be a pretty big signal to the other party leaders that they need to get their shit together or be swept aside. Hopefully they fall in line to help her.
Sadly my expectations for the Democrats is that they will ignore every red flag on their way to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.
There have always been factions in the main parties.
It’s almost like 2 political parties is insufficient representing the people.
With state level electoral reform, we can ensure equal access to our electoral process for all political parties willing to run.
Electoral Reform Videos
First Past The Post voting (What most states use now)
Videos on alternative electoral systems
You’re not really disagreeing. AOC is perceived as the face of the democratic party and it’s true. She’s at least offering consistent resistance while the feckless leadership of the party does nothing but line their pockets and ensure 100 percent unconditional support of Israel to the determient of all else.
I don’t even disagree with your conclusions necessary, if it’s impossible to dislodge Pelosi and Schumer. But building a party from scratch is really fucking hard. Hijacking one might be easier.
They’re going to stay there making bank off of insider trading until they’re so ancient someone accidentally walks through and disperses the dust cloud known as Pelosi, and they finally decide they have enough money to reach supply-side Jesus.
Just insider trading? Those super pacs are the fucking Democrats and Republicans at this point. Greed itself is our new overlord, business ethics are dead and rotting.
Those super pacs are the fucking Democrats and Republicans at this point
they always have been. people have been pointing out how dems and republicans are two arms of the business party for a hundred years
State level electoral reform, allowing more then two political parties to be viable.
“MAKE A NEW PARTY!11111!!1”
That’s not how America works. Only Democrats and Republicans can actually get elected at the level AOC plays at, because the electoral college only recognizes Democrats and Republicans.
Surely 3rd party will work this time!
Weird. The party that claims to be “for the people” keeps putting centrists in charge. We’re ready for someone who is actually for the people!
Quickest way to mobilize the Democratic party is to threaten to put a progressive in charge
They learned their lesson with Obama. The funny thing is he’s not even a fucking leftist, the party is just so full of dinosaurs they think a modern centrist is a leftist.
With Obama they just learned how to take a somewhat progressive candidates and bend them into a moderate. It’s the same thing that happened with Kamala, although of course it’s hard to say if either were ever really progressive or if they just used that for votes and didn’t mind discarding it once they got pressured by the party and consultants.
Kamala was never progressive.
Neither was Obama. Not long after he put a bow on the nomination, he voted for an expansive security bill. A lot of people were surprised, but not me.
plus his voting record pre-presidency was very conservative. they fabricated his progressive persona
Yeah I definitely agree, both Kamala and Obama are candidates that acted progressive in their primaries but as soon as they eventually got the nomination they went towards the corporate Democrat establishment. My main question is whether they were progressive at some point but let themselves be changed by the establishment, consultants, and donors or if they never really cared that much to begin with. The end state is the same but the difference is important as it gives us insight into how much power the consultants and others have over candidates vs if they didn’t really care then it wouldn’t have taken much to change them.
Kamala was picked as VP because Dems thought she would get votes from the republicans who aren’t so MAGA. She’s on the conservative side of things: tough on crime as AG, opposed cannabis legalization (changed position later), opposed abolition of death penalty (flipped later), etc.
Forgot hard on incarcerated trans women…
I’m not even sure it was as deep as that, IMO they shoo’d her in without any chalengers as she could legally use the Biden-Harris
bribesdonations they had already collected. Thats about the extent of their thinking.
In general, no. In terms of specific policies as an AG, there were some.
I’d say she’s a centrist, with some progressive policies and some regressive. Just my opinion obviously.
Obama wasn’t even somewhat progressive before the Democratic Party. He was against gay marriage for a while.
I’m a European born American. Obama would be right wing politician in my country of birth.
The dinosaurs know they’re marching right, that’s where all the money is (for them).
See David Hogg
See Bernie Sanders.
they’d rather lose to Trump for a third term than do that.
They’re definitely for the billionaire people.
DNC: I am here for the working people-- from billionaires, all the way to millionaires.
Aren’t there primaries for the Dems?
Voter turnout in primaries is pathetic. In 30 states, you have to be registered with the party - i.e.: give them your name and address for fund-raising purposes - to vote. This all works to bias primaries to ‘establishment’ candidates, or at least people well known among party apparatchiks. They are, theoretically, the best way to get progressives or populists into office, but practically, those progressives are fighting demographics and the general apathy of voters under 40.
The same phenomena that let MAGA take over the GOP keep the moderates in charge of the Dems. At least, until someone figures out how to motivate all the young internet revolutionaries to actually go and vote instead of memeing about how useless voting is.
You’re blaming the DNC for something that is controlled by each individual state.
Not really. I’m saying that the system discourages change. If there’s blame for the DNC, it’s that their message has constantly been something along the lines of “be reasonable & empathetic; improve the world through measured change” which tends to demoralize people who think the system is seriously fucked. That empowers the career politicians. GOP propaganda, at least for the last 50-or-so years, has been “More guns! More babies! No brown people!” which tends to attract passionate radicals.
The DNC in a nutshell. Absolute garbage.Okay, but the states decide if there are open primaries or not. The State is to blame for that, but it can be changed if made a state ballot measure.
That’s not really up for debate. It’s literally state law and dependent on the state. The DNC and GOP don’t decide that.
Is that not the second sentence in my original comment?
Sort of, sometimes. They can and will heavily disadvantage candidates they dont like. Like when they gave Hillary the questions for debates beforehand but not to Bernie, and let hillary control the funding of races, including her own. And like when they cut new hampshire out of the primary results this year because the New Hampshire dems wouldnt move the date for the primary to when the dnc wanted. So sure you could vote in that primary, but nothing was done with the results. Straight to the garbage can with those ballots.
Russia says they have a democracy too, with votes and everything. Not saying we’re the same, but proving we have “democracy” by the fact that voting happens is not that firm of a thing. Its easily corrupted.
Sadly I don’t think it’s possible to have a party “for the people” with only two parties. There’s too much pressure for both of them to champion the status quo.
“Championing the status quo” is not how I would describe what Republicans are doing right now.
Yes it is. If the part “for the people” turns out to be captured you drop it and get in an actual party for the people. Rinse and repeat as needed. There is a problem with political parties growing too old and becoming too institutionalized. But keeping them in power instead of giving them the boot is a choice made by the voters.
Conservatives, they are putting conservatives in charge. Don’t be fooled by how republicans label themselves. They haven’t been conservative since before the turn of the century.
It’s DNC leadership that has taken up that mantle.
Controlled opposition
Buzzword catchphrase
It all makes sense when you realize who makes the cutoff for what they consider “people.”
The partyThe people that vote in the primaries for the party that claims to be “for the people” keeps putting centrists in charge.Most people don’t vote in the Democratic primaries. Did you?
I’m confused. Are you arguing that AOC is or isn’t for the people?
She absolutely is. Her nomination is the DNC’s nightmare.
She’s one of like 3 US politicians that I don’t just kind of low-key actively hate.
I promise you the Democratic Party will do whatever it takes to keep her away from leadership roles because she actually wants to change things.
That’s the one thing the Democratic Party is consistent on: rejecting progressives, even if it means letting the conservatives win.
always so strange to see the words ‘guarantee’ or ‘promise’ when someone is giving a predictive opinion for an outcome they have no contol over.
I hope she will be successful in actually overtaking the party to some degree, as most high-ranking party members would certainly see that differently
Next to Bernie she’s the best the Dems have to offer. And for any possible run for President, she beats Bernie on age.
If they run Harris again, or Newsom or some other conservative Democrat in 2028, the party is fucked.
Newsom is trying his level best to have a right-of-center glow up right now. I’m almost certain that the DNC plans to tilt the scales for him. They likely will resist running a woman again for a long time because they’ve stupidly come to the conclusion that it was the genitalia of the candidates and not the quality of the candidate, campaign, and platform that caused them to lose what should have been two of the most winnable elections ever.
Progressive woman of color
Or
Conservative white guy with (D) next to his name.
Pretty sure we can guess who will win the primary if they can help it. DNC leadership is not interested in what it’s membership wants.
Absolutely. I can’t see AOC being given a chance in 2028 unfortunately, unless things change a bit. Not excited for Newsom as a candidate :/
You guys need more than just two relevant parties. AOC being this popular should prompt her to start her own movement, supported by Bernie, raher than clinging to the “Democrats”.
They need election reform for that to happen.
And the only way election reform happens is if we get the corporate Dems who like things the way they are (AKA roughly all of them) out of power. It’s damn near hopeless.
Ideally, we get an democrat Bernie or AOC presidency, who then runs for a second term as an independent. Incumbents tend to have name recognition, which would make it easier to give the DNC the Old Yeller treatment. The Geronocrats have a callow ambition, even if progressives manage to Tea Party things. After all, the DNC’s bluebloods will want to retake the throne. It would be best if the throne that they treasure was lost outright.
I’ll trust her judgment on that one.
Seeing how it’s going in USA rn I don’t trust any judgment coming from the country whatsoever
thanks, that’s helpful
Her as president and Bernie as vp. If they kill her then they put someone even more opposed to their views in power.
As much as I absolutely adore Bernie, the guy needs a rest. He’d be starting as VP for a potential 8 year period of two terms at 86…That means he’d be 94 by the time he left office. The man is an absolute beast, but father time catches up with us all and I don’t want to see his final days in politics to be a sad decline after everything he’s given. He deserves to serve as a badass senator, like he always has, until a progressive gets elected as president and then retire.
AOC and Pete Buttigeig as VP, on the other hand…or Tim Waltz again…or Elizabeth Warren for a double team, all woman ticket? Hell yeah.
yeah, one of the reasons the dems are a dead/dying brand currently is because they keep putting in who they feel has earned it the most, not who the population actually likes. That also leads to entire party embarrassment when they fight for that person and they turn out to be an abysmal milquetoast failure like Biden.
AOC - Crockett?
The Gore Strategy
Agree but have the senior members support and coach AOC, have a united front. We’re supposed to support and learn from our elders but they have an obligation to move aside and allow the younger leaders to rise.
Support, yes. Not too sure about coaching, though, I think she’s doing great without needing to consult old white people
Agree but have the senior members support and coach AOC
lol the dweebs that can’t win a slam dunk election because they are too busy running corporate friendly husks
Of course they will. Harris or Buttigeig
Are they… Still considering Harris for 2028??? What? Please god. Make it stop. Please.
It’s.
Her.
Turn.
“It’s my turn.” was everything wrong with Hillary’s campaign in a nut shell.
How the fuck are you able to make yourself look like an unhinged ego-maniac who just wants to be President for the sake of being President, when you’re running against Trump? That shouldn’t be possible.
How the fuck are you able to make yourself look like an unhinged ego-maniac who just wants to be President for the sake of being President, when you’re running against Trump?
This isn’t a problem of Trumpism, it’s a naturally occurring brainworm in Americans broadly speaking. Trump’s a nasty dim-witted freak, so watching him climb to the top of the pile we’ve been raised to believe was a meritocracy causes all sorts of cognitive dissonance. But everyone running for President (except maybe Mike Gravel) ends up looking like this. The thing that separates the Obamas and Trumps from the Hillarys and McCains is whether cheering for the unhinged ego-maniac feels fun or not.
She’s just the most recent candidate. The most recent candidates, and most recent Presidents and Vice Presidents are almost always in these sorts of lists, especially in the weeks and months following an election, before the next campaign starts.
Joe Biden was a favorite in these sorts of polls in 2015/16, despite saying he wouldn’t run, because he was just VP.
I pray to the gods you are correct. Save this comment for 2028
HRC
Take your up vote and go think about what you did.
Praise the lawd!
she’s got my vote
She’s not the face of the Democratic Party
She’s the face of a completely new and different party that has nothing to do with old Democrats.
To me, I’ve been viewing the US as being governed under a one party state for a while … the Republicans and the Democrats form two halves of the same organization.
The US doesn’t need a third party
They need to form a new second opposition party because the old one morphed into the monstrous thing we have today.
The US needs a third, a fourth, a fifth and several more parties as viable alternatives.
They to drop any weird FPTP systems, this will allow new parties to come into play.
This would also end the ridiculous gerrymandering shit
Omg, I love you. I’ve been screaming this since CGPGrey’s videos about voting and alternatives to what we have. Getting that is gonna require all existing party members to be cool with a complete loss of power and an increase in the amount of work the have to do to keep their power or get elected.
It’ll take the states. However, there are already states trying to ban alternative voting methods.
Haha, thank you for your kind words!
As a Swede, the US election system has always seemed so backwards, even the fact that you have to register to vote is completely foreign to me.
And there’s no chance it can get one while $ is in American politics.
Yeah, no.
If no party can get to 270 electoral votes, the president is picked by the House of Representatives.
That means congress would need be flippped into third party majority first.
Splitting the left off only benefits the far right. Anyone who thinks otherwise is stuck in an echo chamber.
This is why stoy said the First Past the Post system needs to be dropped.
Which would require a constitutional amendment, meaning it’s a pipe dream.
Could you explain how Alaska or Maine managed to have a Ranked-Choice Voting system?
One of the UK’s two parties has died and the other is in the process of killing itself. Two party duopolies can disintegrate, even under FPTP, we just have to hope that Left parties emerge, not just rebranded far-right ones.
The Democratic Party is just a vessel. It used to be the right wing (relative). Now it’s the left wing (relative). Bernie and AOC don’t really fit in with the Dems, but they can. Same with Manchin.
There was a time where I thought a Musk type could rally many behind a weird Libertarian version of the DNC or RNC and shift the landscape. But he just went hard fascist as soon as he publicly aligned with the right.
Any time someone can’t tell the difference between centrists and fascists, I just have to assume that their stance is more about arguing than it is about a sincerely held ideology.
Fuck that.
Centrists/Republcian Lites don’t deserve to the party.
They are free to fight republicans over control of that shitshow.
Or put another way, it’s time for the non-fascist party to realign ideologically as part of the Seventh Party Era
Pretty much, yeah.
Taking over the Democratic Party vs starting a new party is kinda like addressing climate change on Earth vs terraforming Mars.
The former sounds painful and bureaucratic while the latter sounds exciting and innovative.
But if you can’t fix the party or planet you’ve got, which has like 80% of the hard work done already, what hope do you have of doing a new thing from scratch?
One of the criticisms against the Democratic Party is that they aren’t particularly democratic. Party insiders and the wealthy hold far more power and practically pick the nominees.
Rather than compare them to the planet from which we were birthed, I would compare them to a shitty boyfriend we’re afraid to dump.
We should be so lucky to have a party she represents in this country. The only reason she has that seat is by defying the DNC as a spoiler. They only elevate politicians to the Federal level on the basis of how good they’ve proven they are at collecting that sweet, sweet corpo bribe money.
The DNC and democratic leadership would rather dissappear her Than Trump by a mile.
The pendulum is the point. Both parties are well bribed to maintain the capitalist’s murderous control. Good cop and bad cop are both just fine with mass homelessness and entire murder for profit confidence scheme market sectors. One laughs at you when the capitalists cause you harm, the other just shrugs and says “golly gee market forces nothing we can do! But I affirm your right to die horribly as who you are here in this cardboard box under a freeway! Pronouns are free so whatever I still get bribed 😁” (edit to be clear, respecting others identity is the right thing to do and basic decency, but there’s a hierarchy of needs, self-actualization only matters if you have your basic needs met. You cannot live in an affirmation ribbon, you cannot eat a preferred pronoun, priorities.)
If the Democrats were led by someone talking about redistribution, that bribe gravy train would stop. If by some miracle AOC manages to steal the party out from under them as Trump did the RNC, the DNC would be fighting her every move and comment the way we wish they were countering Trump right now. In fact, here’s how Democrat leadership spent the months leading to Trump’s inauguration:
https://www.axios.com/2024/12/12/aoc-pelosi-oversight-committee-connolly-raskin
Defending the country from one of the only slightly left Reps in the entire federal government.
Democrats like Schumer and Pelosi are far closer to Trump than AOC.
https://apnews.com/article/business-nancy-pelosi-congress-8685e82eb6d6e5b42413417f3d5d6775
I still have to lol about how the stupid qons tried to use her dancing in university as some kind of BAD thing.
Back when Denver Post still had a comment section and they’d allow gifs, and if the topic was AOC, I’d post her dancing. A few of the local wingnuts would try to get me banned/my posts removed over it, esp. if one of the qanon mods was on-duty…
She’s the best. Why the buzzkills in the unhinged right tried to paint a beautiful intelligent rep like AOC dancing during college as a bad thing is anyone’s guess, but that sure as fuck blew up in their faces…
So let me get this straight: somehow just dancing is somehow worse than drinking beers in fraternities and raping?
She’s a woman with a will of her own, that’s enough for anyone on the Right to hate her.
What I really can’t stand though is when they try to pretend she’s dumb. I mean when we on the Left call Trump a moron, we can actually point to things he did and said. When they try to paint AOC as an airhead, they mostly just repurpose old blonde jokes to be about AOC, there’s never anything she actually did or said that they bring up.
Ever notice that?
God I’m glad I don’t use facebook anymore
She committed the sin of being a woman
She’s a woman and a POC to boot, so…it’s rather self-evident that anything she does is going to be worse.
I think even for the most idiotic of maga, they realized that trying to trash her for dancing was not really getting much traction. Especially among cishet men with eyes? Just sayin’. XD
I think the same thing for trashing her for things like being working class - they were trying that on for a while and that seems to backfire, too. Same goes for some big mic drop attempt they try when they call her “Sandy” in some kind of qnut point about how she had a nickname during high school and/or university? ZOMG! /clutches pearls You are saying she went by the name of Sandy, danced, and worked as a bartender? QED, then, I guess. 🤣
Apparently 🤷♀️
AOC dancing and having fun is somehow anti-American and full blown socialism, according to Republicans.
Why the buzzkills in the unhinged right tried to paint a beautiful intelligent rep like AOC dancing during college as a bad thing
Because she’s leading moral and dignified Christian men into sin!
It’s not my fault / I’m not to blame / It is the gypsy girl / The witch who sent this flame / It’s not my fault / If in God’s plan / He made the devil so much / Stronger than a man
I’ve been saying for about 5 years, maybe better, that she is the person I am most excited to vote for as president of the United States one day.
I don’t even have another name in mind.
I will be as happy to vote for her as I was for Sanders in the primaries, twice. I legit can’t wait.
How about Jasmine Crockett? I hope between the two of them, they start inspiring and generating tons more to go into politics.
Hope Crockett gets to be gov of texas… She reminds me of Ann Richards in all the best ways. She’d make a great president too.
Jasmine Crockett seems to be “AOC but sarcastic”.
