Well it’s known that JMS pitched a space station show and was turned down… and then poof we get ds9.
Either way both are some of the best sci-fi ever.
Yup. DS9 originated as a rip-off of his idea once he got someone to pick it up because Paramount didn’t want anyone watching sci-fi that wasn’t Star Trek. But, it took on its own life and became another great series in its own right.I am a big fan of both and argue that they are very different shows, with DS9 being a bit of a grittier Star Trek but B5 not just being another layer of grit but really being unafraid of directly portraying the consequences of allowing authoritarianism to persist unchecked and the suffering that it causes, without softening it with an alien species acting as a stand-in for the lust for power that some humans have.
Having re-watched B5 recently, except for the CGI, it holds up extremely well. Have been meaning to give DS9 another spin.
Also, DS9 has my favorite theme of any Star Trek series.
EDIT: I stand corrected.
Even JMS has actually admitted years ago that DS9 and B5 being in development at the same time was a coincidence. DS9 was already in early pre-production when he pitched B5 to Paramount. They turned him down, but also asked if he would be willing to retool it as a Trek show. Most likely, they hoped to recruit him as a DS9 writer and didn’t expect him to turn that down. Granted, it seemed super suspicious, but now that Paramount’s documentation has been released it’s pretty clear nothing nefarious happened. The DS9 showrunners weren’t even informed the B5 pitch had happened and the network didn’t interfere with DS9 much if at all, so the only cross contamination came from the handful of writers they shared, like D. C. Fontana.
Thanks for the correction. Nice that it wasn’t actually malice after all, despite really looking like it.
That Paramount seemed to think for ages that the details of how they started production of shows were valuable trade secrets that must never be divulged certainly didn’t help. They could have cleared everything up as soon as it started, but chose to keep their mouths shut, which made them look super guilty. Paramount Executives: making baffling decisions for the past 40 years.
Oh nice! Thanks for the update I’d not heard this!
JMS has been very gracious and I do not believe Paramount.
Oh boy, have I got something for you!
B5’s security guard was supposed to be a shapeshifter. He should’ve sued, honestly. People thought he ripped them off because DS9 came out first.
Straczynski also pitched and write one if the best comic miniseries of the early 2000’s, too. Rising Stars was limited by the style of art that was popular in comics at the time, but it’s one of the best, most cohesive stories ever to be seen in comics at that point. Frankly, I think it’s one of the examples of why comics started to be taken seriously as a storytelling medium, and it’s kind of a mystery why every other edgy early 2000’s comic got the Hollywood treatment, but Rising Stars seems to have been mostly forgotten. I mean, hell, if Cowboys and Aliens can get a major motion picture release and The Boys can be a massive hit, why can’t Rising Stars
or Babylon 5at least get some sort of animated series?Babylon 5 already had a series.
I’m currently listening to ST:Outpost which is a lot like DS9. It tells the story of DS3 and it’s crew. DS3’s captain is extreme about waste management and has the station running at extreme efficiency, leaving it a barren and forgotten place where careers come to die. The crew have learned to deal with this and to make the best of what they have, which oftentimes involves some creative solutions.
It’s a full cast audio play on spotify. It has roughly 84 hours of story. I can heartedly recommend it.
Subscribed; I’ll check it out.
Sounds really interesting, I’ll check it out
DS9 I watched. What’s on the left?
Babylon 5, a lower budget but still AMAZING sci-fi show! You should check it out, season one is kinda good but after that it’s really good, especially season four (though season five is a bit slow in parts)
It’s one of my favorite sci-fi shows of all time!
You also get to see Walter Koenig play a very creepy bad guy.
Ah. I’ve heard great things about Babylon 5 but the first couple of episodes didn’t draw me in. I’ll have to give it another shot.
So, the first season is kinda rocky. Many of the actors are struggling to come to terms with their makeup and costumes, the effects aren’t all that great, and, not wishing to spoil, it’s laying a LOT of groundwork for what is to come. The second and third seasons are AMAZING.
The fourth and fifth seasons…let’s talk about them. What happened was, the network was going to shut down, meaning Babylon 5 wouldn’t get it’s planned 5th season, so they crammed as much A plot into the fourth season as possible to finish the main story. So it’s a bit…intense. Then another network picked up the show for the fifth season after all…after some of the principal cast took other jobs. So they stretched out a lot of the B-plots that were supposed to be in Season 4 into full episodes in Season 5, and…what can I say they made a whole season of TV after the show’s climax.
what can I say they made a whole season of TV after the show’s climax.
They made a cuddle season
If you enjoyed it and did a second watch through you see the immense world building they do in season 1 that ties into later season plots. On first watch through it sounds just like filler, or even just something specific the episode, but it wasn’t as often as you’d think for a 90s show. Even though I grew up in the 80s and 90s I didn’t watch Babylon 5 till about 10 years ago and I still found the first season rough, like close to TNG rough.
It takes a little bit, but it gets really good
GARABALDI
MY FRIEND! COME DRINK WITH ME!
And they made a very satisfying thump when they hit the floor.
Oh I went to the rock to his my face,
And the rock cried out “No hiding place!”
First season is setting building and absolutely necessary for the series as a whole. But if you bounced off the style itself, then it might not be for you.
Well, Star Trek TNG season 1 is also largely puke tier television, to the point that if I were introducing someone new to the show, I’d start at Season 3, and if they’re still interested go back and hit a few key episodes from 1 and 2. If anything, B5 gets its shit together faster than TNG did.
If you can make it through the first season, the quality of the CG of every season after that has a noticeable increase as their budget increases. I wouldn’t say the final season looks incredible by modern standards or anything, but it definitely holds up a lot better than the stuff in the first season.
The first couple of episodes are not great. There were also substantial changes from the pilot, for example the weapon props got a major upgrade. I think it starts getting there around mid season 1 but 3-4, as others mentioned, after really some of the best sci-fi that I’ve seen with writing that aged well in many ways.
Same boat here. I’ve probably watched just about every other space/sci-fi series out there, too, but haven’t been able to make it through the first season of this.
If you can get through S1, it gets really good (part of S3/4 is honestly some of the best sci-fi I’ve ever read/watched)
I would argue that despite the great DS9 episodes and stories, B5 had better stories overall. That being said most of DS9’s CGI aged pretty well. B5’s CGI…not so much. Not even the remastered version.
I agree. I loved both, but I think B5 hit harder and is more relevant.
The effects were what they were. B5 had like half of DS9’s budget. DS9 still used mostly practical effects and models until season 6 which hold up better too, especially vs. early TV CGI.
On the left is what DS9 was ripped off from. The creater of the TV show Babylon 5 pitched a show based on a space station with a shapeshifting security guard where many races meet. Also, there will be an epic war incoming. The creator is an amazing individual for many reason if nothing else for not being bitter toward Paramount.
They both also have Jeffrey Combs.
and Walter Koenig!
Sisko be like “I’ll make my own ship and sail across the cosmos like ancient Bajorans”.
Explorers was the silliest yet most wholesome episode.
It really was
“Oh you say the Bajorans couldn’t do this? Well too bad they could, lemmie show you”
That people have done that same thing IRL to prove that ancient peoples could have made certain voyages is also neat. Across oceans rather than space, but still.
We really don’t give our ancestors enough credit sometimes.
Well dang it, you’ve spoiled my meme for tomorrow! It uses the same template lol
Oops haha!
I’m down for lots of “Trek” “they’re the same picture” memes.
They both were very complex shows that explored morally gray topics. But I prefer DS9
I probably prefer DS9 too (it’s close so it’s hard to say), but I still love both!
They’re both good but I do prefer DS9s take of the utopian Federation being put to the test and breaking point, it makes for more compelling moral dilemmas.
@xusontha Babylon 5 was on after DS9 on Channel 9. A show being on after a good show was usually enough to get me to watch the second show, but Babylon 5 and I did not get a long and it got switched nearly 100% of the time.
Maybe you only saw S1, because part of Season 3/4 is honestly some of the best sci-fi I’ve ever watched; either that or you just didn’t like it, which is totally OK! I would never attach a Drakh keeper to you to make you like Babylon 5, that would be crazy!
