With fighting raging around Khan Younis and in the north of Gaza, a video has emerged on social media showing dozens of Palestinian men detained by Israel.
With fighting raging around Khan Younis and in the north of Gaza, a video has emerged on social media showing dozens of Palestinian men detained by Israel.
And they still call themselves democratic country. Very democratic of them to humiliate human beings whose only fault is that they are of “military age” and not evacuated to the south. Apparently for Israel all males in Gaza are guilty until proven otherwise.
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When people say shit like this it makes me wonder how divorced from reality they are… do you really think it’s highly unlikely that the IDF did this after their other wonderful works:
It is absolutely highly likely that the IDF has not stopped this.
I don’t even want to start with the stories of some of those Israel detained without a charge because it’s fucking tragic. One named Israa, her story is gut-wrenching and one in hundreds. This is what happened after her car broke down by a checkpoint:
She was recently released. I’ll leave a picture of her face just so we don’t forget what kind of shit the IDF does
The example you have used appears to be a very unfortunate set of events. If you can put yourself in the soldiers place they were either worried about a car bomb attack (with the yells of god is great from a stopped car at a checkpoint it’s not that far fetched really) or they were psychopathic if how you are telling it is true. I don’t know the answer, they may well have been both. If it was an unfortunate set of events and the soldier was not psychopathic I could imagine they would probably feel at least some regret over the incident, I mean who wouldn’t? I don’t know
I find it hard to put myself in the place of a police officer who left a woman inside a burning car to explode.
You have got to be some kind of human fucking scum to be okay with this or excuse it in any way. This woman deserves better.
I’m glad you agree it’s an unfortunate set of events. How about what followed? She was denied medical treatment in prison. The Israeli judge who sentenced her did not do her justice, and she was mistreated in prison.
Is this justified? I can share many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many many more fucking stories of the same caliber. Please don’t ignore the fact that Israa’s story is not that unique (sadly).
Finally the only people who were able to release her from the shackles of Israel is a terrorist organization… when you have Hamas do the work of the UN, you have got to stop to think about just how wrong Israel is.
Also have you checked the link to Breaking the Silence?
They have this REALLY LOVELY FUCKING TAB ON THE LEFT where you can choose the testimonies you would like to read about the IDF, such as “looting”, or “assassinations” or “rules of engagement”. All the videos will kick your heart in the gut. And they should. Because what kind of beings are we if it doesn’t kick us in the fucking gut?
Ok I’ll have a look
Ah yes, another apologist. I am sure if Israeli men were stripped and publicly humiliated like this, you would have been the first person to condemn it, but since it is just Palestinians who everyone knows are only Hamas supporters (/s) is just fine, right.
So perhaps you should think twice about who is “full of shit” here having double standards.
No I wouldn’t, this is what happens in a war zone. When the Americans were in the pacific they couldn’t trust the Japanese to surrender so they assumed they were dangerous, the ones that didn’t are probably dead. And also if I can recall, the last military operation from the Palestinian side the people weren’t really rounded up as much as slayed in their homes. The ones that were rounded up ended up being taken hostage. Hold on, I’m the one with double standards. Both sides have done shit I wouldn’t apologise for either side. There will never be peace as long as one side thinks and acts like they are completely innocent
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Removed. You have it backwards:
“Even if only one of these people are combatants I would argue it’s justified for everyone’s safety”
In actuality it should be “Even if only one of these people are innocents I would argue it’s not justified for everyone’s human dignity.”
I understand what you’re saying but this is a different reality. The world you’re talking about needs a certain degree of civility to before it can be seen as reasonable. I know you won’t like this but being a soldier is usually an occupation. The job is to keep things secure. This is for both your own wellbeing and to complete the objective because everyone wants to finish the job and go home safely at the end of the day. Unfortunately sometimes it’s impossible to consider everyone’s feelings in every situation. I agree 100% that if you were a totally innocent person and you got rounded up and stripped it would be absolutely bullshit and unfair. I also think if you were a soldier following orders and you had half your face and arm blown off you would think that was unfair as well
It requires no civility to say that any chance of the persecution of innocents is not allowed. 1 in 20? 19 in 20? Doesn’t matter.
With all due respect you are living on another planet. If you care about respecting the innocence of people who have a high potential of trying to/about to kill you im sure there’s no shortage of openings for those occupations.
Innocent people are innocent people, period. You don’t treat them as having ANY potential for trying to kill you. THEY’RE INNOCENT PEOPLE.
How do you know though?
Everyone is PRESUMED INNOCENT. You don’t prove innocence, you prove guilt.
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Ah yes, stripping naked people and keeping them in the cold for hours and hours and then streaming this online is all because of the safety of Israel. How dare I question their sound judgement, right? So international laws don’t apply to Israel either, that’s my friend what I call double standards.
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Simple math comes to mind 1200 killed vs 17.000+, that’s about 14 times more.
Shall we also talk about the displacement of millions of people who were forced out of their homes, are struggling to get food, proper health care, and not having fuel or electricity. Are not able to escape outside Gaza.
What Hamas did was horrible, but shall we not expect a bit higher standards from Israel?
Didn’t they actively cause a humanitarian catastrophe affecting 2.4Mln people, half of which are children. Aren’t the Gazans struggling to get the basics like food and water? Do they have proper sanitation, electricity, or fuel? And who’s to blame all of this? Who is bombing their homes, preventing adequate quantities of food and water to reach the civilians, who is blocking international aid, besieging hospitals and have very little respect for human lives? Damn, even your closest ally is telling you that what you are doing is wrong and you still claim that Israel has the high moral ground.
Yes 7th of October was disastrous but what Israel is doing is nothing less than collective punishment and for any sane person this should be pretty obvious. You don’t need to be a genius to see that one evil doesn’t excuse another evil.
I’m sorry wtf is this logic? One side only killed 1700 so the other is immoral if they kill more than 1700???
This my friend is called common sense and basic empathy. You know empathy not only towards Israelis, but also towards Palestinians. Because every life matters no matter the religion, colour, ethnicity, etc.
Ok so you’re missing my point. If there are two groups of people living side by side and one group decide to murder 10 people from the other group, you’re trying to say it’s immoral if the other group kills more than 10??? Am I getting this insanity correct? We skip over the whole deciding to murder 10 people in the first place and we start our ethical counters only once the retaliating group hits what the original murderers deem as reasonable retribution? If it’s overstepped, now is when the immorality begins? This has the most retarded parts of eye for an eye written all over it. No man has the moral judgment for eye for an eye to be functional. Of course lots of people think they do and then fail to understand why others think they were unreasonable in their retaliation.
Two groups of people living side by side? Way to omit 75 years of suffering in a single stroke.
Suck my Wang indeed.
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Think about what you’re saying
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You said supplies were pouring into Gaza. This is an obvious lie.
Why do you lie?
Thanks, Hitler.
Oh, can you please answer the following questions:
And now replace Israelis with Gazans and answer the same questions.
Oh so now you are openly admitting that Israel isn’t any better than a terrorist organization. Well done mate!
Saying that 50-60 trucks a day even 200 can satisfy the needs of 2.4Mln people is very hypocritical of you. Don’t forget that Israel isn’t doing anything to alleviate this situation and quite the opposite trying to make it even worse, punishing again civilian population. Mind you there aren’t any established humanitarian corridors, designated safe places, the north is more or less entirely cut and delivering aid there is next to impossible etc. so how easy would be to distribute this aid.
And speaking of economical recovery, if you think that Israel would have a hard time to recover tell me how much harder that recovery would be in Gaza. Where in the north according to independent estimates 50-60% of the civilian infrastructure is damaged and 20% in the south.
And by now it is quite obvious that you are extremely biased. But yes, still thinking that Israel are the only victim here and they are not to blame for anything. Not even for the impunity of violent settlers with which they are persecuting Palestinians in the West bank, or any other well documented human rights violations, which all those “corrupted” human rights watch groups have documented.
You know when everyone is saying that you are not doing enough to protect civilian population in Gaza, even your closest ally the US is saying this is time to look very good in the mirror and ask yourself whether they are all wrong or perhaps you are in the wrong.
About 650,000.
I’m not sure how many homes that 650,000 owned but I suspect a lot of them.
Your list of grievances are because Palestine is still at war with Israel. To attack a country and not expect reprisals and negative consequences for civilians is pretending the realities of war don’t exist. Peace is the path to ending said grievances.
That’s a fat lot of conflation.
And a whopper of a revisionist history. Israel has been blockading Gaza for nearly 2 decades now. That is an act of war. You don’t get to keep doing that and complain that the other country punched you.
And war does not justify war crimes. It’s literally in the name.
I am now 110% convinced you’re just a troll who spouts incorrect information so that people spend ages educating you on just how dumb and wrong your statements are. A total waste of time.
No.
Just no.
This reasoning is literally the kind of stuff we hanged Nazis for. Collective punishment is a war crime. Leave the civilians alone.
War? Don’t wars usually have sovereign nations on each side, fielding actual militaries and such. Looks more like an ethnic cleansing operation to me. By one sovereign nation on an ethnically defined and enforced internal enclave that isn’t even recognized to be a real place by half the world
The military on one side are a group of cowards hiding behind civilians and under their infrastructure. There are two sides here. The government of Gaza aka terrorist group Hamas vs Israel.
If the existence of Hamas among Gazans makes them all terrorists then I guess the IDF makes Israel a terrorist state.
Anything other than that is a double standard.
Israel has yet to even prove the tunnels are in use. All it is right now is a ready built excuse to carpet bomb any urban area in the world. Because they are all riddled with tunnels.
FFS is that where the latest goalposts have been moved to now? Go check out the Hamas propaganda. They’ve shown enough videos of them using the tunnels.
Sure thing, but there is no command center under the hospital. Israel likes to pretend we all forgot their bullshit.
What you forget is your previous statements. They’re always conveniently replaced by demands for more proof from Israel, right after the previous one was met.
Isrsel is the one who provided fake evidence several times, notably last time with the staged video of that mam surrendering in his underwear,
Israel has lots of explaining to do. If you can’t see that, I can’t help you.
Israel never proved shit. No command center under the hospital. No Hamas fighters surrendering. All their audio clips from phone calls were doctored or thrown together or extremely vague. They pretended to deliver fuel to one hospital and took the phone call with the head of the hospital out of context to make it sound like they refused it. Like a cartoon they marked supplies with “BABY FOOD” on A4 papers. Right now they are surrounding anotjer hospital, killing anyone who leaves.
Israel has a strong prpagnda machine, and if you can’t see it, it’s because you are a victim of it. It’s because it’s riding your ass and you haven’t been able to look right, left, and behind to understand.
And stripping them of clothes? The only POW pictures I ever saw like that came from Abu Ghraib. Probably because it’s a war crime. Nobody is objecting to the control measures.
They don’t care about Israeli soldiers’ lives. Don’t bother.
That’s how war works. You think it’s all hugs and love in a war? What if one of them have a suicide bomb belt? You might want to look into how US army treats the locals in Iraq war. Every war has war crimes(so far I don’t see any committed by Israel). Every war has civilian casualties. Some people are fixated on civilians death from bombings. Well, if they are bombing Hamas targets and there are civilians, that’s just how any country would have done it. US did the same. Any country would do the same. So let’s get off your high horse and start criticizing both sides. I haven’t heard any liberals pointing finger at the Hamas. It’s sickening.
Oh hey, sure. I can tell you exactly how we did it in Iraq. On both counts. So when you first make contact with the person you’re going to detain you have them stop at a distance. Then someone with a thermal sight looks at them through the sight and it’s readily apparent if they have a bomb vest on. I mean there’s no chance of not seeing it. But it could be something like a money belt or an armor vest. So you have them disrobe if, and only if, the guy with the thermal sight says it needs to happen. At that point if it is a vest and they’re cooperative it’s an EOD problem. If they aren’t cooperative, well that sucks.
The key thing here though, is in the 99.9 percent of cases it’s not a vest, or there was no positive indication, they keep their fucking clothes. Just like your local PD is capable of searching you without stripping you, so is your friendly neighborhood infantry platoon.
Now about bombing. Before you can drop any ordinance you have to first answer a few questions.
*Is this structure currently being used by the enemy?
*Are there signs of civilians, or is it somewhere we would reasonably expect them to be? (Such as an apartment)
*Is this structure on the protected targets list? (Oh yeah we spent time creating lists of things not to shoot at if possible.)
If the answer is yes to the first and any of the others we then also need to figure out if it rises to a level where bombing it is appropriate. For example, bombing an apartment building because there’s 12 guys there is a war crime. But if there’s a Battalion dug in there, then yeah it’s legitimate.
What Israel has been doing is scanning satellite and drone footage for anything that looks like it could be the entrance hatch to a tunnel and bombing that. No matter where it is and with no evidence as to whether it’s a maintenance tunnel or the yet to be found super secret bad guy hang out. If I did that in Iraq I’d have been brought up on charges. They tried to bring me up on charges for firing a warning shot. So please tell me more about how, this is just the way it’s done. I’ll be over here shining my CIB, waiting for the answer.
I’m not the person you asked this question to but wanted to answer anyway:
No. It was a refugee camp.
Yes
Not sure about the list Israel has, but yeah refugee camps should be in there.
Israel has practically assassinated so many doctors in Gaza by killing them all when they return home to check on their families. 16 of them died in their own home, not in service, with a large portion of their families. Israel knows what it’s doing. It knows where targets and non-targets are… it’s just that they decided that medical professionals and 4 year old girls are targets.
For the record I lost all confidence in the IDF to discern targets correctly when Reuters reported the IDF fired on a press group who were just standing around in the open.
Here are some Lebanon “incidents”
There is another video of a crew of journalists who had their vehicle bombed twice by the IDF. Luckily, they managed to escape before being killed. I couldn’t find this video but if someone has it please do share.
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
Rif
some footage here
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source; check me out at GitHub.
That other countries would do it too does in no way make it morally justified, it just makes those countries monstrous as well.
Hamas are horrible terrorists. There, your first liberal pointing a finger at Hamas. Now, consider what the point of critique is. Will Hamas ever care about western criticism? No. Will Israel ever care? Maybe. They depend on Western support in their political and economic stability. Therefore continued scrutiny and criticism of Israel has a chance of actually making a difference.
Also, only one of them is currently doing something that looks a lot like genocide.
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Every single time Israel commits a war crime someone is like “tHatS jUsT wAr oKay?”
That’s not what Israel said about October 7th is it?
So why should be Palestinians settle for it?
Because they don’t have the means to fight back and win. Because if they insist on intifada they will end up with nothing.
Ah okay so we should then just accept a genocide. Bravo.
Only if you redefine genocide so much that the term is meaningless. Israel is obviously not trying to eradicate an ethnic group. High civilian casualties via collateral damage does not a genocide make.
So you’re saying all those experts at the UN “redefined genocide”?
Oh the mental equilibristics to try to excuse war crimes and clear dehumanization from Israel. Seriously you should ask what kind of a person you are if you defend them.
Maybe address the arguments being made rather than the ones making them. Not everyone thinks these are war crimes, and whatever dehumanization you see here could very well be for security reasons and not Abu Ghraib style psychological warfare.
Whether or lot they are war crimes is not a matter of taste. Your argument is stupid. We’re not waiting for your opinion on This.
Withholding fuel and water and meds from a population is collective punishment. Causing starvation in the population shows intent to kill them. Documents detailing how Israel wants to push Gazans into Egypt is intent to commit ethnic cleansing.
Somehow YOU think you are smarter than all the human rights experts. Meanwhile, a genocide is unfolding.
I don’t usually wish evil upon people but I do hope you one day get to experience such a degrading treatment personally. Let’s see if you then find a “security reason” for it as they look up your ass to check if you have weapons, then keep you in an undisclosed location on your knees like a dog, then you never get released, and fast forward for 10 years and you’re still a prisoner of Israel despite having no charge and you get tortured in prison all the time. But don’t worry, I’m sure it’s all JUST SECURITY
What exactly do you think democracy means and why does this run contrary to it? Democratic countries go to war all the time, especially when attacked. Perhaps this is about disarming and searching potential hostiles and not humiliation.
In the evacuation zone? Yes, and they have stated as such, everyone there will be considered a potential enemy combatant.
‘Evacuation zone’ aka these peoples homes and communities, where many other civilians need rescue and aid. No no please keep supporting the idea that 2 million people can just move to an undeveloped plain and have all aid including food, water and shelter withheld. Collective punishment is a war crime.
Monstrous take. Do better.
When nations go to war they go to war collectively, everyone who lives in said nations will have to all share the negative consequences of doing so. That is how war works. Counter-attacking a belligerent nation that attacked you and cutting off their supply lines is not collective punishment as in the war crime. That only applies when they are occupied, and Israel withdrew from Gaza and has not occupied it since 2005.
Inaccurate concern trolling, attempting to to bind Israel’s hands and deny them from achieving meaningful safety. Do better.
“meaningful safety”
LOL
KILL, KILL, KILL FOR PEACE
Israel thinks its god, doesn’t it? Announces a military zone anywhere at all, then shoots people there right and left. What we have left is entire families wiped out, and 7k dead children, and a few thousands that are so traumatized and radicalized now that Israel has effectively set the stage for the rise of the next Hamas.
Thank you Israel 👏 you have indeed saved us all 👏 👏 /s
Counter-attacking a belligerent nation != thinking itself god. You keep making these absurd statements…
Nothing happened before Oct 7th in your mind.
Do you have a copy of Mein-Kampf on your nightstand?