Yeah you can’t count the people that didn’t vote as “against Trump”.
If anything you can lump them in with “for Trump” because they couldn’t get off their pathetic asses to stop a felon rapist pedo traitor from becoming the most powerful American.
You could argue the former, yes, I’d concede that.
Though, I couldn’t say also that makes them “for” tRump… just not opposed to him. Neither is right, mind you.
This is a situation where I truly wish that “Did not vote” was the winning candidate.
And precisely because so many people can’t imagine any ‘solution’ beyond impotently signing off on new rulers and calling it a day, we are doomed to keep on with this whole farce. We told you this would happen a decade ago.
Not everyone who didn’t vote did it out of apathy. The Republican playbook includes disenfranchising as many people as possible, making it effectively impossible or extremely difficult to vote.
But not LITERALLY impossible. I didn’t have to, thank the gods, but if I had to I would have gone REAL far out of my way to ensure I voted to keep a felon rapist pedophile traitor from dictating my future.
It’s not. It’s ALLOWING with the exact amount of steps. Now, there is no argument to be had that this isn’t still a pathetic, apathetic, route to force us all down. Inaction is still an action. I am not defending those people, either.
I can’t despise them as much as active supporters… apathy is for sure the lesser of two evils there.
But, yes… “if you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.”
I could say indifference IS better than malice or willful ignorance… but, this could easily be disregarded as desire to ignore the greater concern (which I think you’re driving at)
MLK’s expression of,
“He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it.” Comes to mind.
Sure, we’re getting philosophical… but I couldn’t refute that standing, without deploying willfull ignorance of my own.
I am, vehemently, clinging onto the notion that people in my country are ignorant and lazy, rather than fully malicious… I can stomach the former far easier.
clinging onto the notion that people in my country are ignorant and lazy, rather than fully malicious… I can stomach the former far easier.
Agreed. Unfortunately, the more I converse with conservatives in particular, but also people on this very platform that defend not voting in 2024, the more I’m starting to lean towards fully malicious. There are a lot of non-conservatives on this platform that appear to be accelerationists that want full collapse, which will only serve to end many, many innocent people’s lives.
Yeah, agreed… my outlook is pretty bleak for my country, and by that I mean its people.
Conservatives are truly a lost cause, in most situations. The exceptions being people too blinded by propaganda to see the harm they’re doing.
I don’t see a lot of people “defending” non-voting, but that may be more anecdotal.
Dude, not everyone is as plugged in as you are. Some people don’t watch the news at all. Some people just go to work, come home, and do their own thing. Not everyone is terminally online.
Despising people for living their lives differently than you is just childish.
If you live in a democracy it is YOUR DUTY to pay attention, inform youself, and vote intelligently to maintain that democracy that many, many people DIED to give you.
If you don’t, you’re a piece of trash.
This was a no brainer. A TRAITOR ran for office after attempting to violently end our democracy. Every piece of trash that didn’t show up to vote against that traitor is a piece of trash.
I’m here, aren’t I? Of course I’m way more plugged in and consume far more news than the average person. I vote, all the time. I encourage people I know and meet IRL to vote. Of course the US would be a better place if everyone were a bit more engaged. With each other, the world around them, politics, and the news.
But I get pissed off when people don’t seem to grasp that not everyone thinks like they do and they never will. When people are disgusted that others act differently than they do… I hope you can see why I would have a problem with that.
And when I find someone so willing to completely disappear up their own asshole about CIVIC DUTY and a bunch of people deaf for centuries… Just shut the fuck up already. Nobody cares except for the people that already think exactly like you do.
I remain firm that counting people that didn’t voten if they had the chance as not wanting Trump is wrong. They accepted what the majority wanted. So I say “yes the majority wanted Trump”. And that includes the popular vote.
I can agree that they did the wrong thing… but not voting isn’t what I’d call “wanting” It’s something more akin to “allowing” him to win. Which, isn’t any better. I am near about arguing semantics, I know.
Maybe saying it like that is a bit provocative but from my perspective it’s functionally the same. They didn’t care enough to make their voice heard so I feel like I can say that they wanted it that way. If they didn’t they should have voted.
I get it… and I earnestly agree with most of your sentiments. I’m probably just clinging to hope that people aren’t such disappointments as to WANT it, so much as “not care enough” to avoid it.
(If that is even somehow better)
No. You don’t get to dismiss those that didn’t vote. It’s like everyone wants to ignore the Law of Large Numbers when it comes to elections. The cold, hard truth is that even if we had 100% turnout, Trump still would have won. You seem to think that every non-voter was a potential vote against Trump, without stopping to consider how many would be a vote FOR him.
The Law of Large Numbers means that yes, over 50% of the country wanted this. You don’t get to say it was only 30%, and treat the non-voters like a single bloc that would have voted differently. And I get it. It’s comforting to think that it’s only a third of the population that are full of hate and pants-shittingly stupid. But its well over half. American citizens are fucking idiots, and that’s not an unfair generalization to make.
The law of large numbers only applies to a random sampling. There is very clear indications that targeted disenfranchisement has been applied to the American electorate for decades. This indicates that if more people had voted, or been allowed to vote, that the results would have changed, or at least that’s the belief of those who set things up this way. Those who aren’t voting due to apathy may or may not be represented accurately by the votes cast, depending on the cause of their apathy.
I mean sure, downvote me for pointing out the obvious. The Law of Large Numbers is an actual thing. It’s why we can get accurate poll results while only polling ~1000 people. And the more you get, the smaller the margin of error becomes. We had about 65% turnout last election. At that level, the margin of error is essentially zero. Trump won the popular vote. That last 35% wouldn’t have changed anything.
Our problem isn’t that we have a vocal minority terrorizing the majority. Its the majority that’s a problem.
My country spent decades pretending it was the greatest to ever exist while it’s citizens embraced ignorance and stupidity until we reached the point we’re at now. Over half the population are people who should never be trusted with a decision. Oh, they’re not evil, they’re just dangerously gullible idiots. And it’s the decisions those dangerously gullible idiots have made that might wind up killing us all.
So yes, I hate Americans in the same way someone who grows up in a racist family hates their own family. Because there are only two options when you grow up with these dumbasses: you either hate them, or become a dumbass yourself.
About 30% of the country. The other 70% was either on the right side of history, or too apathetic to vote. Most Americans DIDN’T want him.
Yeah you can’t count the people that didn’t vote as “against Trump”.
If anything you can lump them in with “for Trump” because they couldn’t get off their pathetic asses to stop a felon rapist pedo traitor from becoming the most powerful American.
You could argue the former, yes, I’d concede that. Though, I couldn’t say also that makes them “for” tRump… just not opposed to him. Neither is right, mind you. This is a situation where I truly wish that “Did not vote” was the winning candidate.
Not voting is the same as wanting with less steps
And precisely because so many people can’t imagine any ‘solution’ beyond impotently signing off on new rulers and calling it a day, we are doomed to keep on with this whole farce. We told you this would happen a decade ago.
Not everyone who didn’t vote did it out of apathy. The Republican playbook includes disenfranchising as many people as possible, making it effectively impossible or extremely difficult to vote.
But not LITERALLY impossible. I didn’t have to, thank the gods, but if I had to I would have gone REAL far out of my way to ensure I voted to keep a felon rapist pedophile traitor from dictating my future.
It’s not. It’s ALLOWING with the exact amount of steps. Now, there is no argument to be had that this isn’t still a pathetic, apathetic, route to force us all down. Inaction is still an action. I am not defending those people, either.
I SO wish that I had a valid argument against what you’re saying. But I don’t.
Those who didn’t bother to vote against him tacitly endorsed him
They made a choice to allow him to become president, even if they didn’t vote for him
I despise them as much as his supporters
ESPECIALLY the second time around
I can’t despise them as much as active supporters… apathy is for sure the lesser of two evils there. But, yes… “if you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.”
I’ll take your Rush quote and raise you another.
“Indifference is the strongest force in the universe. It makes everything it touches meaningless. Love and hate don’t stand a chance against it.”
That being said, I’m not sure apathy is the lesser of two evils.
I could say indifference IS better than malice or willful ignorance… but, this could easily be disregarded as desire to ignore the greater concern (which I think you’re driving at) MLK’s expression of, “He who passively accepts evil is as much involved in it as he who helps to perpetrate it. He who accepts evil without protesting against it is really cooperating with it.” Comes to mind. Sure, we’re getting philosophical… but I couldn’t refute that standing, without deploying willfull ignorance of my own.
I am, vehemently, clinging onto the notion that people in my country are ignorant and lazy, rather than fully malicious… I can stomach the former far easier.
Agreed. Unfortunately, the more I converse with conservatives in particular, but also people on this very platform that defend not voting in 2024, the more I’m starting to lean towards fully malicious. There are a lot of non-conservatives on this platform that appear to be accelerationists that want full collapse, which will only serve to end many, many innocent people’s lives.
Yeah, agreed… my outlook is pretty bleak for my country, and by that I mean its people. Conservatives are truly a lost cause, in most situations. The exceptions being people too blinded by propaganda to see the harm they’re doing. I don’t see a lot of people “defending” non-voting, but that may be more anecdotal.
Dude, not everyone is as plugged in as you are. Some people don’t watch the news at all. Some people just go to work, come home, and do their own thing. Not everyone is terminally online.
Despising people for living their lives differently than you is just childish.
I’m lucky enough to live in a civilised country
We have compulsory voting, which is absolutely fantastic
It prevents the kind of stupidity that is 'Murica
If you live in a democracy it is YOUR DUTY to pay attention, inform youself, and vote intelligently to maintain that democracy that many, many people DIED to give you.
If you don’t, you’re a piece of trash.
This was a no brainer. A TRAITOR ran for office after attempting to violently end our democracy. Every piece of trash that didn’t show up to vote against that traitor is a piece of trash.
Bullshit. Dead people have no bearing on how the living operate. The only duty people have is to fucking feed themselves and such.
Found the loser that doesn’t grasp how important democracy is or that people DIE for it so that others that come after them can benefit from it.
I’m here, aren’t I? Of course I’m way more plugged in and consume far more news than the average person. I vote, all the time. I encourage people I know and meet IRL to vote. Of course the US would be a better place if everyone were a bit more engaged. With each other, the world around them, politics, and the news.
But I get pissed off when people don’t seem to grasp that not everyone thinks like they do and they never will. When people are disgusted that others act differently than they do… I hope you can see why I would have a problem with that.
And when I find someone so willing to completely disappear up their own asshole about CIVIC DUTY and a bunch of people deaf for centuries… Just shut the fuck up already. Nobody cares except for the people that already think exactly like you do.
You don’t have to be terminally online to inform yourself of your choices for a few minutes every for years.
This is your reminder that civil participation shouldn’t be considered a right, but a privilege.
I’d say neither, it should be a duty
Voting literally is a “civic duty” for those who want democracy.
I think it’s a privilege to take part in the duty that is civil participation/ engagement.
Fair
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I remain firm that counting people that didn’t voten if they had the chance as not wanting Trump is wrong. They accepted what the majority wanted. So I say “yes the majority wanted Trump”. And that includes the popular vote.
I can agree that they did the wrong thing… but not voting isn’t what I’d call “wanting” It’s something more akin to “allowing” him to win. Which, isn’t any better. I am near about arguing semantics, I know.
Maybe saying it like that is a bit provocative but from my perspective it’s functionally the same. They didn’t care enough to make their voice heard so I feel like I can say that they wanted it that way. If they didn’t they should have voted.
I get it… and I earnestly agree with most of your sentiments. I’m probably just clinging to hope that people aren’t such disappointments as to WANT it, so much as “not care enough” to avoid it. (If that is even somehow better)
Even of the votes actually cast Trump hasn’t won by a majority.
He absolutely did. Trump got 77,302,580 popular votes vs 75,017,613 for Harris. Electoral it was 312 vs 226. So a majority wanted Trump.
He didn’t, he got 49.8% of the votes cast for president. The majority of votes were cast for others.
No. You don’t get to dismiss those that didn’t vote. It’s like everyone wants to ignore the Law of Large Numbers when it comes to elections. The cold, hard truth is that even if we had 100% turnout, Trump still would have won. You seem to think that every non-voter was a potential vote against Trump, without stopping to consider how many would be a vote FOR him.
The Law of Large Numbers means that yes, over 50% of the country wanted this. You don’t get to say it was only 30%, and treat the non-voters like a single bloc that would have voted differently. And I get it. It’s comforting to think that it’s only a third of the population that are full of hate and pants-shittingly stupid. But its well over half. American citizens are fucking idiots, and that’s not an unfair generalization to make.
The law of large numbers only applies to a random sampling. There is very clear indications that targeted disenfranchisement has been applied to the American electorate for decades. This indicates that if more people had voted, or been allowed to vote, that the results would have changed, or at least that’s the belief of those who set things up this way. Those who aren’t voting due to apathy may or may not be represented accurately by the votes cast, depending on the cause of their apathy.
Ok.
Sure and you’re not a bigot.
I mean sure, downvote me for pointing out the obvious. The Law of Large Numbers is an actual thing. It’s why we can get accurate poll results while only polling ~1000 people. And the more you get, the smaller the margin of error becomes. We had about 65% turnout last election. At that level, the margin of error is essentially zero. Trump won the popular vote. That last 35% wouldn’t have changed anything.
Our problem isn’t that we have a vocal minority terrorizing the majority. Its the majority that’s a problem.
The problem I have with you is your bigotry. Which is why I succinctly said that. You didn’t need to write so much, we all get it, you hate Americans.
My country spent decades pretending it was the greatest to ever exist while it’s citizens embraced ignorance and stupidity until we reached the point we’re at now. Over half the population are people who should never be trusted with a decision. Oh, they’re not evil, they’re just dangerously gullible idiots. And it’s the decisions those dangerously gullible idiots have made that might wind up killing us all.
So yes, I hate Americans in the same way someone who grows up in a racist family hates their own family. Because there are only two options when you grow up with these dumbasses: you either hate them, or become a dumbass yourself.