In the lesser of two evils they choose Hamas, which I find insane. I can certainly understand being very against and hating Isreal, but to me Hamas are literal demon scum cockroaches. I have a higher opinion of the Russian military than I do Hamas. And support of Ukraine is something I feel incredibly strongly about.
I think this is a minority opinion here though.
Hamas is a product of Israeli occupation. The IDF is a product of Israeli national identity.
If it wouldn’t be Hamas, it would be a different violent organization, like before PFLP, PLO, etc. When people are brutally oppressed, it leads to violent resistance, that often will not limit itself to military targets.
back Hamas over Israel
Even here, the setup is false. Anyone remotely affiliated with Hamas is little more than a blood smear on the pavement in Gaza at this point. Israelis are torturing general surgeons to death and calling them Hamas. They’re butchering babies and calling them Hamas. They’re gunning down European photojournalists and calling them Hamas.
There is no “Hamas” left to support. It’s just the stamp Israel puts on the body bag.
The sheer barbarity of Israel is incredible. What is even more incredible is how this is actively fucking over western democracy. Israel is willing to throw down every single freedom in the West (from electoral freedom, to freedom speech, to privacy rights… everything) just so they have a few more settlements built on the graves of people they want dead.
The entire war on terror is Israel’s fault. I am going to say it. Modern Islamic fundamentalism is a product of the Cold War, but almost every form of modern international terrorism has its roots in Israeli action and the blowback to that.
I am American jew. I recently replied to an email from my old synagogue about volunteering in Israel, explaining I have no desire to aid Israel with their Nazi Stockholm manic episode, but to have fun working on the new Holocaust.
Top bad they don’t live in a democracy lmao
What the hell kind of apples and oranges headline is that. Israel is a country. Hamas is a political party, not the same as Palestine or Palestinians.
I’d go with terrorist state personally.
It is sad that nuance is lost in this conflict. If you condemn Israeli action on Palestinians, you are accused as anti-Semite. If you condemn the October 7 attack, you are accused of being Zionist and supporting the genocide on Palestinians.
There isn’t ironic bothside-ism on this. Literally both sides are actually at fault. Majority of Israelis back driving the Palestinians out of West Bank and Gaza, and majority of Palestinians want Israel as a country to be destroyed. If anyone have watched or read Attack on Titan TV series or manga, this is a major theme in the story of intergenerational conflict. Two state solution is the only way for the conflict to end, and it isn’t like there was no precedence to lay down arms and live in coexistence (see how the conflict in Northern Ireland ended when both opposing sides agreed that enough is enough). But there is too much bad blood between Israelis and Palestinians to call quits any time soon.
I look forward to being called an Anti Semite, being a Jew who’s been to Israel twice, and watched my sister get Bat Mitzvah’d on a synagogue roof near the Wailing Wall, and was active in my temple youth group until I graduated High School.
That’s because Israel is treating it as such. They are treating Palestine and Hamas equally by killing both. If the question was rephrased as do you support Hamas or Palestine the vast majority would side with Palestine. Most people don’t know the difference between the 2.
Although this question is framed in the shittiest way possible, I would still support Hamas over the IDF because only one of these organizations are guilty of genocide.
Easiest call I’ve ever made.
That’s disturbing, both sides are POS’s.
Thanks for the enlightenment.
Israel managed to figure out to turn a vicious terrorist group into the good guys.
That’s the main pitfall of this topic. There doesn’t have to be a “good guy” in every conflict. Killing over 1000 Israelis on October 7th, mostly civilians, was unjustified as is keeping the remaining hostages (it’s clearly not restraining the IDF). Likewise blocking aid, destroying hospitals, and targeting journalists is completely unjustified. If you ask me who’s trying their best to do what’s right for their people I would say Hamas.
I think the real problem is that they’re both trying to do what’s best for their people, and they’re both crap at being the best for their people.
Hamas and the IDF both want the other side dead dead. No matter who wins, that’s a lot of dead folks. The path to a peaceful resolution has probably become some convoluted and overgrown I’m not sure possible to hack our way through. But truthfully, that takes both orgs being willing to take that path and I’m not sure that’s on the table anymore.
Israel is winning and we’ve all got blood on our hands, btw. But if we backed Hamas and they were winning we’d have the same blood on our hands.
Oh, for sure. We’re talking what’s the bigger of two massively negative numbers.
Or we back neither, strongly condemn genocide, proclaim our commitment to Peace, and act as the neutral party to negotiate a peace treaty.
Turns out when people break out of a literal concentration camp to fight back against their oppressor they’re
freedom fightersterrorists
Polls are a great way to get the answers you want. I don’t know what the pollsters wanted, but to me the question in question is skewed, because one is a state while the other is an organisation.
“In the Israel-Hamas conflict, do you support more Israel or more Hamas?”
So my answer would’ve been “I support Palestinians in their struggle to have their own country again over Israel which is clearly on an aggressively expansionist rampage.”
Since that isn’t an option I can refuse to answer the stupid poll, or say I support Hamas.
Shouldn’t we explain the nature & history of the struggle instead?
edit: obvious pro/contra Hamas discussion ensues. But IMO it’s moot - at least for the foreseeable future - because Israel is so obviously the much bigger monster here, and has been for a long while, and because denying a nation the right to exist simply is not acceptable.
While you’re not wrong, I think framing it as “israel-hamas” rather than “israel-palestine” is the least favourable framing available (for a supporter of Palestine) without resorting to really obvious leading questions.
As such, seeing a majority opinion against Israel is encouraging. I’d expect a more nuanced survey to swing more heavily against Israel
framing it as “israel-hamas” rather than “israel-palestine” is the least favourable framing available
Isn’t that exactly what I said? Maybe my phrasing is off.
MartinSands point is that even though GenZ probably don’t support Hamas murdering civilians, they still consider their struggle as more virtuous than Israel when given no other option; meaning support for Palestine is likely much higher than the poll suggests.
I thought you were implying that the survey was so unreliable that we couldn’t reach any conclusions about support for Israel, or the lack thereof. I was trying to point out that we could (tenuously) reach at least one conclusion.
You said it right.
It’s not that 60% support Hamas, it’s that 60% oppose Israel
Hamas are just a group of men whos families were blown up by the IDF. not saying their actions after are not evil but I understand their mindset. If the world has condemned you and your people to death simply for existing, what other options do they have?
I get that 100%. I have said it about MAGAs in America. I have people very close to me who are members of vulnerable groups that MAGA is targeting. If ANYTHING was to happen to them, I would become very dangerous indeed. That’s a bright red line for me.
This. Only time I’ve ever been violent is when someone harms a person I love. I’m letting MAGA know now. Fuck around and I promise I’ll be your find out.
They´re also just a group of men who´ve blown up other families to stop the Oslo Accords
Stop shifting the blame. Netanyahu admitted sabotaging the Oslo accords . The PLO accepted the term of Oslo they stop attacking Israel and acknowledged Israel as a state . How Israel thanked them? They did by expending illegal settlements, arming settlers and defend them when they commit terrorism against west bankers. The PA collaborate with israel while trash talking them . Once israel decide to completely annex west bank the PA leaders will all get murdered by israel
Yeah, after Hamas helped Netanyahu into the PM seat with their bombing campaign to stop the peace process, he was able to sabotage it all he wanted, mainly by fully backing the settlement movement. But my point is: what if Hamas wouldn’t have done so?
Israelis voted for Netanyahu because they are ok with the occupation. You love to make it just about Netanyahu but all the other Israeli prime minister are war criminals
what if Hamas wouldn’t have done so?
Israel would still have continued occupation and building illegal settlements because it is still ruled by the supremacist Zionist ideology
Netanyahu was down more than 20% after the peace accords had been signed. Hamas’ string of bomb attacks in the runup to the election helped him to narrowly win the vote by 0.5%
I repeat all israeli prime minister was war criminal who brutalized Palestinians . Even most Israeli population do not give a damn about Palestinians so no hamas is not the reason why israel is still occupying Palestine and are committing a genocide
Uhhhhhh what? Not saying what this men did wasn’t evil, but there’s very few men on this earth that wouldn’t retaliate when his people are being slaughtered. Did you know the Nazie’s labeled partisan Fighters in their occupied territories terrorists too!?
That’s the same justification Bibi uses for his side’s killings
Ya but he has the actual power. That’s the difference.
And
…and do you think that made the world a better place?
Exactly. I don’t care if Hamas is wiped out, they’re objectively awful, it’s the Palestinians getting killed in the crossfire that’s the issue.
Of course, they aren’t really getting caught in the crossfire, they are the targets. Israel is just using Hamas as an excuse to throw bombs around residential areas, hospitals, and schools.
Its not just gen z.
60 percent is also the portion of Gen-Z that chose not to vote in the last US election. If you don’t vote, you don’t count!
@Saleh This is a drawing of the Great Mufti of Jerusalem #AminalHusseini wearing a #Kufiya meeting Hitler on November, 28 1942 in Berlin.
The survey did not ask participants whether they support Palestinians more broadly, despite Israeli leaders repeatedly framing their war as being against all Palestinians, not only Hamas.
@Saleh Reads like nonsense, sorry.
You know how reading works, no?
@crandlecan The part ‘Israeli leaders repeatedly framing their war as being against all Palestinians, not only Hamas.’ is reducing the context/is wrong.
