in case anybody who doesn’t know, poly doesn’t mean everyone is dating each other. Someone in a poly relationship can date someone who has no interest in dating their other partners. ofc a good rule of thumb is that everyone in this metaphorical web should be able to sit down and have dinner with each other without being mean or violent with each other.
So it’s like de-federating
Explain relationship between people using the Fediverse. Please and thank you.
Fuck, I’ll never be able unlink federated social media and polyamory in my head now.
Fundamentally they both come from anarchist ways of thinking. If there is no higher order or rule, and nobody has any veto power over anyone else, then the only thing left is to manage each relationship on an equal footing.
Poly for me is about the basic idea that nobody gets veto power over anybody else’s relationship, which means exclusivity simply doesn’t happen. It’s just like if you had a friend that said you weren’t allowed to have other friends. That would be weird, and there’s no real reason why romantic relationships should be any different.
interesting, because for me the appeal of poly relationships (specific kind, mind) is specifically the idea of being exclusive with a group of people, like we’re all married and equally into each other.
I mean if you find that arrangment happens to you organically then great, but ultimately if you have three people all together, that’s three pairs. Four people is six pairs.
There’s no getting around that fact, that’s just how many combinations there are. And if just one of those pairs breaks up for whatever reason, then that mutual group stops working. It’s a very tenuous arrangement. It can also be a big strain on the other pairs when that happens, especially if it breaks with the understanding of what the group is supposed to be.
That’s why I think it’s best not to have that kind of arrangement as a goal. It can happen, but trying to make it happen creates a situation where some pairs will feel pressure to go along with it even if they’re not a good match, which is a recipe for further drama. If there’s no goal like that, then people can feel the freedom to keep their connection loose if they feel like it.
While this is certainly a valid form of romance, it’s more accurately described as “non-exclusive simultaneous relationships” than a single “polyamorous relationship”.
Some people really do live in multi-partner committed households, but those seem most often to be dominated by a single person, such as fringe Mormon polygamy. And the most common form of "polyamory’ is probably “affair-tolerant monogamy.”
It’s a big complicated world, and variations of how humans with form intimate relationships fills all possibilities when there is no enforced legal prohibition. (And,.sometimes, even then.)
As a poly person: no, it is not a “affiar-tolerant monogamy”. That is an open relationship.
Polyamorous partnerships are far more committed. Also, sex is not always a part of it.
Of course there is the concept of a primary partner, but there are lot of poly folks that thislike this idea.
But what all of those relationships have in common: there is no case where only one partner is poly. All is about communication and consent.
And to the core topic: There is this thing like a polycule. A network of people with somehow connected relationships. Breakups in those structures are often consensual and no big fuzz. But if it gets dirty, at least in my experience, the offending member of the polycoule gets shown the door. And most of the times, those are the new ones. People that think the could convince their partner to get monogamous because they are the only one that is needed.
Sorry for the long post, you hit a nerve there ;)
There are a lot of different types of poly relationship structures and different names for them. The base unit of relationship is a standard couple where 2 people are together. Add another person in and they can either be in a relationship with only one of those people and form a “hinge” aka “V” or be in a relationship with both of those people and form a “triad” aka “throuple”. As many people as those involved consent to can be added this way.
Most of the time it’s one person who is in a relationship with multiple people who are each in relationships with multiple people. This forms a “polycule”. Where you have the people you’re in relationships with aka your “paramours” and they have the people they’re in relationships with aka your “metamours”. This group of relationships can take many forms and can be drawn out into a cool diagram like a molecule, hence the name polycule.
The people you’re in a relationship with can break up with you like in any other relationship and vice versa. It’s more complicated when you add in housing situations if you’re all living together, multiple people are all dating each other, or if two people are married.
Using one of my breakups as an example:
I’ve been in a triad where one person broke up with the other. I was then put in the middle of their breakup drama. I set a boundary of not wanting to deal with their drama/shit talking of the other. One of them kept breaking that boundary, so I broke up with that person while still being in a relationship with the other. Luckily I was living with the person I stayed with or that would’ve been way more complicated.Man I can’t even form a diatomic bond and y’all mfs getting polysaccharides and shit
I dated a free radical once. Nothing but broken bonds left in her wake.
I thought myself noble, a gas at social gatherings. But, always ended up alone. As if I had a shell that kept people out.
if only STI’s weren’t a thing, polycules would be great….
but, i’d rather be single than have to deal with pustules on my genitals for life….
….
i bet they’d all be cured by now if idiots didn’t see it as some divine retribution….You know we can test for those things now, right? As long as everyone remains faithful to their partners its not an issue.
If 300 people all get tested and are clean, they can all get together every night for a massive orgy and there is zero STI risk. As long as none of them sleep with anyone outside of the group that hasn’t been tested.
you can’t just test for these things without symptoms.
most of these diseases have dormant phases and active phases… like a cold sore….Er? You absolutely can do an STI screen without symptoms. Some of the most common STIs don’t even usually have symptoms.
not how that works, virgin
LOL. I know that’s how it works because I’ve done it several times.
lol, and how many STI’s does that screen test for? HIV and Hepatitis only?
I don’t know how healthcare works where you live, but here you can. Its free, no questions asked. Get the results a couple of weeks later.
they don’t test for every single disease… it’s not where i live, it’s medical technology….
show me a screening test that tests for every single SDI or STFU….repeating yourself is pointless. gimme proof or i do not care about the words you’re typing on here.
show me… any country, any price, show me your comprehensive, 100% accurate screening of every possible STI… or even something close to that… i’ll hold my breath.
Chlamydia, syphilis, HIV, gonorrhoea. Sure you could have herpes and that isn’t tested for there but it has pretty obvious symptoms. Its generally a good enough test for the general population and if you need something more specific you can just list your symptoms.
i’ll hold my breath
Please do. The gene pool could use some bleach.
Must be nice in that small section of western Europe. For the rest of us things are not so blissful.
It works this way in the rural american southeast. Grew up in Alabama. Literally just find a college town.
Yeah, anyone practicing safely can avoid that issue.
Yep, this is exactly it. Practice safe sex, get on PrEP for HIV prevention, talk about testing and status with any potential sexual partners in or out of the polycule, and get tested every 3-6 months.
yes because you can absolutely trust and guarantee safety amongst everyone in your polycule, and because you can totally be safe from STI’s that are transmitted by skin contact….
you can be safer, but not safe
Yeah it’s better to just be alone forever. Isolation smisolation
nothing is completely safe… walking down the street isn’t completely safe….
acknowledging risks isn’t the same as saying don’t take any risks….
chump.Lol. Obviously. You said polycules can’t be great, not me.
i said no such thing
I am unsure if that is completely true as my past experience in the lifestyle was that everyone was very on top of regular STI (think you meant this not SDI) testing and safe sex practices to protect all involved, whereas normal dating there is a lot less of that plus secret polycules you are not even aware you are in (cheating). Not seen a study on this but this was my observation at least.
STI… but the problems with people cheating are present in polycules or any other relationship…
people lie and cheat….i’m not saying they’re completely bad and nobody should ever do it (sorry downvoters, you have my blessings), it’s just the kind of thing that concerns me in these scenarios….
afaik, people tend to do things like get herpes, not tell anyone, and tell people it’s not even worth tripping over… just a lil herpes…
and as long as your polycule isn’t a closed loop, it’s essentially infinitely large….
Personally I would never be in a relationship with someone who would do that but i am pretty picky with very firm boundaries.
people i wouldn’t think would do such things end up surprising me
Yeah no one would fuck with me like that besides my family if they had a legit convo with me. Over text is kind of whatever. Its like that Tyler tweet one sec I’ll find it
gets voted out
slowly takes out an immunity totem i found in a charity shop.
the immunity totem is the part of the lease where it says your name and not everyone else’s
it must really suck if sudently 2 boyfriend, 3 girlfriends, and 3 non binary partners decide to risk homelessness rather than stay with you.
Sigh… Another thing I really doubt I’ll ever get- a throuple of myself, a femboy and a tattooed anarchist punk with green hair, who’s just rlly cooooool.
🙄
Is there a poly equivalent of something like the Magna Carta?
Lemmy needs an out of context community
I have heard of something called the “poly bill of rights” IIRC
<serious> They mostly don’t. Poly people think they do, but you see far, far more relationship volatility in polyerotic relationships than you do in monogamous.
Edit: I see that I’m getting downvoted by the people that are in non-monogamous relationships. Fact is that when you talk to sex-positive sex and relationship counselors, they will almost universally say that functional polyerotic relationships are the equivalent of post-doctoral work, while most people have relationship abilities equivalent to a barely-literate middle school level. It’s not that multiamorous relationships are bad or wrong, or that the people that engage in them are wretched examples of humans (…although there are certainly more than a few of those) or anything like that, but to be functional that type of relationship requires a far greater level of self-awareness and honesty than most people are capable of. Hence the reason that they tend to be so volatile; more moving parts, more chances to fuck up.
In my personal experience I have found that most multiamorous relationships are more casual and less emotionally intimate (e.g., more shallow) than monogamous relationships. The people I have personally observed, including my own partners, have had less time to spend with any single person, and were more likely to jettison relationships rather than putting in the hard work to fix problems.
People be down voting you, but as someone in a years long poly relationships, most people are definitely not capable of handling it. Most people can’t even handle monogamous relationships.
I feel like there’s too many poly relationship structures to be able to generalise them all like that.
There’s plenty of people who have open relationships, where two people have a very close relationship (sometimes married) but they aren’t sexually exclusive with each other.
I’d also wager that some poly relationship structures would be more stable for lgbt people rather than heterosexual people, solely on the idea that everyone could participate more equally.
None of what I said is restricted to any specific form of multiamorous relationship, or any sexual orientation or gender identity/expression. Most of the people trying to engage in polyerotic relationships–by which I mean the overwhelming majority–are people that have signed up for an ultramarathon before they can successfully complete a 5k fun run.
We’re really just sharing opinions though, not facts.
I haven’t found any solid evidence that poly relationships are inherently more difficult or prone to failure than monogamous relationships. Long-lasting relationships are just hard in general.
My opinion is strictly anecdotal; I’m not a professional, I can only speak to what I’ve personally seen, and that may or may not be representative.
OTOH, if sex and relationship counselors are saying that the overwhelming majority of people are doing multiamory badly, then their opinions have a lot more weight. Are they necessarily correct? No, of course not, any more than the opinion of any one doctor could be full of shit (see also: any doctor that thinks trans-ideology is a woke-mind virus, or whatever they’re saying now). But it has a lot more weight than opinions of non-professionals.
Are most relationship counselors saying that though?
Like you said, professionals can be wrong, but I’d still be interested in knowing what the general consensus is.I guess it’s hard to know without surveying them all.
I would have to look up names, but yes, all of the sex therapists and relationship counselors that I have personally heard talking about it specifically say that it’s a very advanced form of relationship, that it’s far, far more difficult than any conventional/monogamous relationship, and that most of the people doing them are doing them badly.
Is that authoritative? No. There definitely could be selection bias in that the podcasts and interviews that I choose to listen to, and the articles that I choose to read, that touch on sex, sexuality, and relationships are also ones that will confirm my opinion. (And this opinion, BTW, did not exist before I was in a multiamorous relationship for about 3, maybe 4 years.) I like to think that I’m pretty open about sex, sexuality, and relationships, that I don’t assign any particular morality to any given practice, and that I look largely at how well people find their own individual needs being met within relationships rather than whether the structure is A or B. But, at the same time, I was raised in a culture that is primarily monogamous (often serially monogamous), and normalizes that style of relationship, so I might have unconscious implicit bias.
Imagine getting broken up with by 2 people, both with non-binary haircuts. I’d probably jump into a river and become a trout
IT AFFECTED THE TROUT POPULATION
What’s a non-binary haircut?
