• agitatedpotato@lemmy.world
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    11 months ago

    Therapy doesn’t fix any of the most pressing issues I have. I’d wager about 85% or more of my stress is economic or environmental in nature. My big three worries are how am I gonna afford a house by myself, how am i going to be able to retire on little money and without kids, and is the envrioment going to lose the ability to sustain human life while I’m still alive and on nothing more than a fixed income.

    I don’t need to journal my thoughts and pretend the outside world doesn’t exist, I need some damn material security in my life.

    • Ookami38@sh.itjust.works
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      11 months ago

      The thing therapy has helped me with in regards to that is feeling okay despite it all. Being content despite not having all of our wants and needs fulfilled is a valuable skill.

      • agitatedpotato@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        Being content despite not having needs met feels like a skill thats more valuable to my boss than me. Nah im gonna get my needs met.

        • Ookami38@sh.itjust.works
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          11 months ago

          There’s only so much that can be done to meet one’s needs. There will always be wants and needs that go unfulfilled, it’s just the nature of being human. Being able to exist with that, without it causing you extreme distress, is a very valuable coping skill that’s lost in a lot of people.

          This doesn’t mean eschew meeting your needs completely, but simply acknowledging that some may be actually impossible to fulfill right now, at least safely, and working on an actual viable plan, instead of panicking and doing whatever short-term fix seems handy.

          • tmyakal@lemm.ee
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            11 months ago

            There will always be wants and needs that go unfulfilled

            That’s not what ‘needs’ means.

          • agitatedpotato@lemmy.world
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            11 months ago

            Im glad working on a viable plan and panicking are mutally exclusive for you, but they’re not for me. This is why my therapist started suggesting I simply stop paying attention to everything outside of my immediate daily view. My brain also failed to make itself happy through that kind of ignorance. Not to mention I couldn’t simply make that information unexists from my day to day social interactions. I was encountering at work what my therapist told me to avoid and since it was word of mouth it was less reliable than if I had just read it myself.

            Actual doctors have tried, years have been spent and by the time I stopepd going id been going on about a year of weekly visits where I was no longer being taught anything new, simply checking in and making sure I was doing all the things I already learned. Copays were eating away at my actionable steps to fix the other problems in my life and I was no longer learning anything new or noticing positive behavioral change.

            • Ookami38@sh.itjust.works
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              11 months ago

              Sounds like a therapist that just didn’t mesh with you. If they’re just doing routine maintenance and not suggesting ways to improve either they’re not suited to your situation, or there’s something else confounding the situation.

              You don’t have to completely put on blinders to be content despite being without. You can see all of the things you’re missing, or actively working towards but not at yet, and not be thrust into the middle of an emotional response. This is simply the point of my statement.

              • agitatedpotato@lemmy.world
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                11 months ago

                Ive been to multiple therapists, usually I switch when I get to the maintainace phase, except the last time when I just decided to save the money all together. This isn’t something that happend in isolation, and like I said last comment literal doctors have also intervened in some of these areangements. Please stop acting like you posses some truth I have yet to find. ‘Emotional response’ or not, having needs going unmet causes mental and physical duress and side effects, necessarily. No matter how happy you pretend to be about it.

                • Ookami38@sh.itjust.works
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                  11 months ago

                  I never said they didn’t. And I never said you have to be happy in the face of it. There’s a distinct difference between “content”, the word i used, and “happy”, the word you seem to hear.

                  Society fuckin sucks for the majority of people, I think we can all agree on that bit. And yet, a lot of people manage contentedness despite these absolute facts.

                  There exist things outside of our ability to control, directly or otherwise. Often, these things get in the way of our needs. You have 3 options in this case. Give up, ram into it with everything you have and fuckin hope it works, or accept it and find a way to be content despite the roadblocks.

                  • agitatedpotato@lemmy.world
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                    11 months ago

                    Yes and I’m telling you I’ve spent years going to professionals trying to feel ‘content’ and it doesn’t really change shit. Either you can swallow it and smile or you’re gonna gag. Therapy didn’t move the needle nearly as much as investing in the knowledge and infrastructure to remove myself from the problem, which is property and small scale farming. Notice how the only thing standing in my way is means, means I was slowly giving an insurance company who took more than their fair share from my doctor or therapist to tell me to try and smile about it instead. Therein lies my point, therapy solves my bosses problems not mine, it’s a distraction from mine. You’re mileage may vary, but like I said way up top, therapy can’t solve every problem. Hell therapy can’t solve the same problem for every person either with how wildly different peoples brains are even on a chemical level. Sometimes it works, other times it doesn’t. Like every other medical treatment.

              • Promethiel@lemmy.world
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                11 months ago

                I want to commend you for what you’re doing. It doesn’t feel good, but you must remain effective. You can’t re-align schemas through Internet comments however, don’t burn yourself out.

                • Ookami38@sh.itjust.works
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                  11 months ago

                  Hey, man, thanks for the kind words! I enjoy these kinds of conversations, I like to think I’m working towards making the world a better place, no matter how small. If one person resonates with what I’ve said, I feel accomplished.

                  • lurker2718@lemmings.world
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                    11 months ago

                    I want to thank you for your messages here. I agree with promethil that you need to consoder yourself, i think texts like yours can do quite something good. Sure you won’t heal someone with a few messages. However, I was brought to a mindfulness training* mostly by a reddit chain of comments and this helped me, along other things, a lot, getting out of difficult times.

                    *An app called “Mindfulness Coach” by the US Department of Veterans Affairs

        • lurker2718@lemmings.world
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          11 months ago

          I understand your point, and I also think a bit in this direction. But i think there may be two counterpoints.

          First you beeing depressed over the status and worrying at home and online about it, is not really helping your or doing anything against your boss.

          Second, as i understand it, the goal is not to get really content, but to get more control over your feelings. It is perfectly fine if zou feel sad or angry over the situation. It shows you what you want or do not want. But this doesn’t need to control your life. If you have the possibility you should definitely use your anger to give you energy for the fight for better working conditions. But if you can not, you should your feelings taking complete control over you

      • agent_flounder@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        I think it is worth pointing out that while therapy can certainly help you manage stress better and be more content maybe, if you are truly struggling and falling further behind here in the US, no amount of therapy (which you can’t afford anyway) is going to make you stop being hungry, sleep deprived, heal severe injury or illness, or give your home back. And going without food, sleep, or housing can lead to death.

        • Ookami38@sh.itjust.works
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          11 months ago

          Those items are a bit trickier for sure. There’s a biological need for them and so they can be pressing. There’s a certain bare minimum that yeah, you can’t just not have. Anything past that, though, past the absolute critical for life level, is something you can learn to be content with, learn to not desire more than, and instead just be thankful for the excess above starvation that you enjoy in this moment.

        • Ookami38@sh.itjust.works
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          11 months ago

          Feelings of extreme loneliness. Accepting that, despite having a very real need (community, belonging, connection) not being met at the moment doesn’t mean that it ever will be, and I can actually be okay being uncomfortable, but still content.

          • ThatWeirdGuy1001@lemmy.world
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            11 months ago

            Being content despite all of it.

            We shouldn’t be striving to be “content” we should be livid, pissed, terrified, motivated.

            Being content while the world is falling apart is madness and the more people that are “content” means more people unwilling to actually make the changes necessary to fix the problems we have.

            Apathy is death.

            • Ookami38@sh.itjust.works
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              11 months ago

              “content” doesn’t preclude any of that.

              “Content” simply means you feel as if you could live life with what you have. It doesn’t mean you can’t WANT more. It doesn’t mean you can’t hate how badly the system is bending you and others over. It’s simply a state of being that is, “at the end of the day, none of this is unbearable. I will continue living, and as such, there’s no need for an extreme emotional response.”

              Drive, desire, fight… all of it can exist, and you can still maintain contentedness.

              • ThatWeirdGuy1001@lemmy.world
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                11 months ago

                there’s no need for an extreme emotional response.

                That’s the part I’m having issues with. There’s very much a need for extreme emotional response.

                Idk clearly I’m not picking up what you’re putting down and I apologize for seeming so hostile. I’m just at the point of wanting to commit acts of terror because the people in charge are making protest illegal.

                I just don’t see how that’s any different from “it is what it is” in the first place.

                • agent_flounder@lemmy.world
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                  11 months ago

                  UK? Yeah that shit is scary. I am gobsmacked they’re pulling that authoritarian crap.

                  I’m probably full of shit but here is what I’m thinking. Some things like employers not paying enough and treating employees like shit in various ways-- that is depressing if we are totally helpless. If we can form unions and protest in effective ways, that actually get some reforms going, then it feels like maybe there is some hope.

                  Content isn’t the right response. Neither is giving up in despair. Being able to channel anger and frustration productively seems lots better.

                  If you’re lonely for a bit, or some things aren’t going great you can learn to live with that, for now while also working on fixing what you can. Spinning your wheels fretting and self-pitying doesn’t help but taking action does.

                  Some things will always be outside of my control.

                  It is probably best to find a way to accept those things. Rather than stewing about them. Because all that does is make me feel worse.

                  • Ookami38@sh.itjust.works
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                    11 months ago

                    I think you pretty well nailed my view of contentedness with your paragraph starting “if you’re lonely…”. That’s pretty much how I see it. It’s a state of being okay, despite some needs not being met in the moment. Tend to urgent needs, be ok with some less urgent ones sitting for a bit, accept things you have no control over, and work towards bettering your position overall, instead of sitting and wallowing in the self-pity mire.

                • Ookami38@sh.itjust.works
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                  11 months ago

                  Man, I get it. I’m at that point, too. In a lot of ways society has failed all of us.

                  Society is also a large vessel that takes lifetimes to change. Essentially, the kind of thing one man can do barely anything about. Not that we shouldn’t try, but… Well, to quote Stephen King, “pray for water, but dig a well while you wait.”

                  I think the best way to describe it is, if I feel content, it’s a sense of stability within myself - a sense that I’m grounded, and going to get through. Some of my needs right now are going under-fulfilled, but that won’t be eternal. I’m uncomfortable now, but discomfort doesn’t mean I’m in a situation where I should panic and start grasping at the first possible way to fulfill my needs. Instead, I can be comfortable in my discomfort, think about what my needs actually are, and create a plan to fulfill those needs in a more healthy and sustainable manner.

                • lurker2718@lemmings.world
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                  11 months ago

                  I think I understand you. I also think there are needs for extreme emotional response. However, I would be interested how often they helped you in, and how often the only effect of these was making you feeling worse?

                  I did some therapy in this direction. And I am generally more content. I can enjoy way more time of my life than a year ago, even in similar situations.
                  But if we talk about the status of the world, I am at least as angry and sad as before. And I also do at least as much to change it as before. Which, to be honest, is not as much as I would like.

                  Edit: I think I can actually experience emotions more intense now, while not being overwhelmed by them.

        • Ookami38@sh.itjust.works
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          11 months ago

          It is what it is, with more steps, some emotional processing, and some self-analysis to find out why it being what it is is so annoying to you, maybe.

      • Jarix@lemmy.world
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        11 months ago

        If you are content without a need being filled, it does not fit my description of need.

        So again you are saying it is what it is

        • Ookami38@sh.itjust.works
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          11 months ago

          You have needs that go unfulfilled all the time. You’ve never been hungry without any immediate food? Part of being content is being able to go without needs for a certain period of time, being safe in knowing that it ISN’T going to be forever.

          This, of course, doesn’t mean you can forego every need forever. Yeah, being without food or water too long can and will kill you, but that doesn’t mean you have to have that need 100% met 100% of the time.

          Of note, I’m not saying that people just shouldn’t eat. That’s the kind of need that we as a society should have figured out by now, truly. But going without SOMETIMES okay, and learning that is huge.