Over the first four days of Israel-Hamas prisoner exchange, Israel arrests 133 Palestinians while releasing 150.
…
But the worry for Palestinian prisoners does not end after their release. The majority of those freed are usually rearrested by Israeli forces in the days, weeks, months and years after their release.
Dozens of those who were arrested in a 2011 Israel-Hamas prisoner exchange were rearrested and had their sentences reinstated.
…
Many of the women and children released during the truce have testified to the abuse they experienced in Israeli prisons.
Several videos have also emerged in recent weeks of Israeli soldiers beating, stepping on, abusing and humiliating detained Palestinians who have been blindfolded, cuffed and stripped either partially or entirely. Many social media users said the scenes brought back memories of the torture tactics used by United States forces in Iraq’s Abu Ghraib prison in 2003.
Israel: arrest
Palestine: kidnap
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Im not defending the Israeli practice here, it’s ridiculous and likely to make matters worse.
I can see how they would use different wording for a legal authority taking into custody specific people under their own jurisdiction, even if it’s on shaky legal grounds, and people storming over the border, snatching people randomly off the street while randomly murdering others.
Again, this is not a defense of the Israeli practice, as even the article seems critical of it, but I could not justify calling these very disparate things by the same word.
Let’s start calling them what they are. The Jew-Nazis.
Sounds like you thought that Hitler didn’t go far enough with “exterminating the jews” by calling all Jewish people nazi terrorists
No, I think the post is equating the actions of both groups. Seems fair enough.
I’m drawing some very obvious parallels in how they were treated and how they treat the Palestinians.
Is this the only thing you do? go around accusing everyone that criticizes the state of Israel of being antisemite? I’m against the CCP, does that mean I want the rape of Nanjing all over again?
On the other hand, what kind of blood and soil assumptions do you have to make to assume Israel represents all Jews?
When the primary medium of negotiation is of prisoner exchanges, I suppose you can expect humans to become currency.
The people arrested will have been charged, right?
What that other person said, but also being charged under Israeli law doesn’t prove much about a Palestinian’s innocence or guiltiness. The word Apartheid is an understatement of what’s going on in Palestine.
Being charged never says anything about anyone’s guilt or innocence, anywhere.
yes mainly because they aren’t recognized as citizen of Israel
And even when they are, they are not good enough.
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They have less rights by law its unquestionably apartied.
when you are not a french citizen, you indeed have less right in France than a french. The problem is the definition of Israel’s border is really blurry
You’re not listening, Israel also classifies people based on religion and again there are nationalistically Palestinians in Israel. They’re forced to have citizenship but that doesn’t mean they identify as isreali.
It’s not at all blurry, they’ve been defined by multiple nations and the UN itself.
…because the Zionist Jew-Nazis of Israel have absolutely zero respect for any defined borders. They’ve defied the ones set up in 1938, 1947, and again in the 60s when the UN stepped in again. You can look at the progression maps over time, that 100% is the Jew-Nazis violating repeatedly the treaties set.
No they don’t. Israeli Arabs are full citizens.
Palestinians aren’t Israeli, which is the core of why this argument devalues the concept of apartheid.
No one said they weren’t, I said they have fewer rights because it’s an ethnostate.
There are Palestinian isrealis dumb dumb, as I’ve said before do research before you comment.
… So palestine doesn’t exist/shouldn’t exist as a free state. No Israel is not an ethnostate because Israeli isn’t an ethnicity but a nationality made from ethnicity of all over the world including arabs. Palestinian is also a nationality.
You see an ethnostate generally don’t have more than four current language in use
Are you really gonna triple post the same shitty argument scb?
It’s literally not an ethnostate if there are people of different cultures and ethnicities with full citizenship.
There are Israelis of Palestinian origin. However, policies against the different nation of Palestine aren’t apartheid. They’re often bad policies, but apartheid doesn’t mean “dumb shit policy.”
It is if they have fewer rights by law, that’s called apartied and makes it an ethnostate.
Apartheid refers to the implementation and maintenance of a system of legalized racial segregation in which one racial group is deprived of political and civil rights. Apartheid is a crime against humanity punishable under the Rome Statute of the International Criminal Court.
a state that is dominated by members of a single ethnic group
Full citizens with less rights. That’s like saying Jim Crow America was fine because African Americans were full citizens.
Bro. Just stop. You’re ackshually-ing all over everyone’s face.
You’re being pedantic. They are second class citizens of the State of Israel. They are rounded up and put into open -air prisons, and they do not enjoy the same rights as Ashkenazi Israelis. Israel is an apartheid state.
They are rounded up and put into open -air prisons
This is not accurate.
Gaza is not an “open air prison.” That is figurative language, to describe the awful conditions in Gaza.
It is not a literal prison. No Israeli citizen is “rounded up and sent to Gaza.”
Ok fair, it’s a concentration camp.
In my experience most people who say it’s not an apartheid haven’t really studied the history of Apartheid South Africa.
There are many features that resemble it, such as the tiered rights system, shifting people into designated areas with a system of checkpoints and barriers, creating resource scarcity, etc.
Even the rhetoric about God giving the land to the ruling ethnic group (who in both cases had ancestors subjected to concentration camps) is a similar narrative.
It’s no coincidence that present-day South Africa has been one of the loudest voices calling for UN intervention in Gaza.
Do not downplay the term apartheid or genocide like this. Israel is an illegal apartheid state. And they are committing a genocide. Denying this really raises eyebrows you see.
Israel is an illegal apartheid state. And they are committing a genocide.
Lol both of these are wrong though.
If Israel doesn’t want to be called an apartheid state it should stop its apartheid.
Here you are, lying on the internet again - I can’t say I’m surprised at your lack of integrity - you’re a fucking genocide denier.
The UN disagrees with you on both points.
- Palestinian casualties in the “conflict” are pretty squarely in-line with the broader Palestinian population, making it pretty indisputable the IDF is indiscriminately killing Palestinians, not targeting Hamas.
- The Netanyahu administration has been spouting all sorts of genocidal rhetoric.
- The Netanyahu administration actively propped up Hamas over moderate orgs. Seems like someone needed a pretext for the thing they’ve been trying to do for decades.
- The Netanyahu administration has indiscriminately halted the movement of Palestinians, and cut water, power, food, trade and aid. Some of these have been restored thanks to international pressure - open war crimes and whatnot.
- The UN has characterised the Netanyahu administration’so management of Palestine as an open air concentration camp.
- The IDF has killed tens of thousands of Palestinian civilians - a major share of those deaths were children.
- The IDF lies relentlessly - tunnels built under the Al-Shifa hospital by the Israeli government? No - that was Hamas… But Hamas beheaded all those babies - trust us, bro - we’ve got the evidence, but can’t share it or have it verified. Then there’s the Arabic calendar nonsense, the “hospital” curtain bullshit, the list goes on.
Some of these have been restored thanks to international pressure
well that’s impossible as every country except the free republic of Iran are turbo zionist^and that’s why shooting their citizens is justified
he IDF is indiscriminately killing Palestinians, not targeting Hamas.
Can I call that an “act of resistance” ? Yeah no would be pretty fucked u
But Hamas beheaded all those babies
the tabloid who made up that claim is now making its main title about how israel is genociding gazans.
tunnels built under the Al-Shifa hospital by the Israeli government?
If you really were not feasting on Tsahal propaganda you would realise their first lie was “we can absolutely enter gaza and destroy the HAMAS” so except if they lost two brigades before october I can’t really see how they could have built the tunnels
but can’t share it
they hamas did share the videos, the strafing cars, the gunned festival goers… the rape. Then Tsahal shared the pictures : the bullet ridden cars, charred corpses
But don’t worry, you’re right,the War of Liberation is glorious, the war is just, the war is fair, the war is just, the war is beautiful
every country except the free republic of Iran are turbo zionist^and that’s why shooting their citizens is justified
Strong opener there.
Can I call that (the IDF indiscriminately killing Palestinians) an “act of resistance” ?
You could call a nuclear power occupying a territory, and operating it as an open air concentration camp, restricting water, power, movement, food, and trade, killing the people there an act of resistance, but you’d look pretty silly.
the tabloid who made up that (beheading babies) claim
The IDF isn’t a tabloid that’s publishing headlines about their genocide.
I can’t really see how they could have built the tunnels
I won’t bother with the evidence - I’ll just point out that you’re defending bombing a hospital… To achieve what?
they hamas did share the videos
Of the babies the IDF lied that Hamas killed? No.
If you weren’t desperate to defend a genocide, you wouldn’t have to say such stupid shit.
Lol the real countries of the UN agree with me. The extremely united and extremely politically manipulative Muslim bloc doesn’t. Who cares what totalitarian hellstates think lol.
I skipped the rest of your message because you were wrong in the first sentence.
Ah yes - the Muslims don’t count… Nor does the definition of the word genocide, or the US strategic interests in propping up Israel…
Got any more of those feels for me? You’re a less effective liar than most backing this genocide, so there’s probably benefit to you parading your dopey bullshit around for all to see.
Isn’t it funny that those opposed to the UN are usually also trying to sweep a massacre or two under the rug?
You think you’re defending Israel but you’re actually doing a much worse service to it. If Israel is guilty of apartheid, which I think it is, it has a clear path to redemption. If however the Israeli crimes are sui generis, then we end up with a whole new class of crime against humanity called “the crime Israel is doing to the Palestinians”, for which the international order has no precedent for how to redeem. And that’s a huge danger for Israel because it opens up the space of possible reactions, much much more widely than apartheid.
The crime Israel is doing to Palestinians (I’ve seen Nakba suggested as a name, so I’ll use it for brevity) extends beyond Apartheid. The Nakba’s intent is to take apart Palestinians’ ability to exist as a political collective by dividing them and implementing varying levels of Apartheid and violence against them, up to and including genocide. This goes beyond South African Apartheid, whose goal was for black people to serve white people. The Nakba is meant to destroy Palestinians as an entity capable of having political will. This is why they’re currently divided into Israeli citizens, East Jerusalemites, Gazans and West Bankers, with the goal of eventually ethnically cleansing the latter two (along with East Jerusalemites on a larger timescale).
The Nakba includes Apartheid as one of its components, but it’s not Apartheid.
I just imagine a world where Arabs didn’t try to kill jews moving to the region in the lead up to WWII. I wonder if that would have changed anything in terms of now.
I just imagine a world where the Jews who immigrated to Palestine didn’t force my family out at gunpoint and under the threat of massacre (Deir Yaseen) in 1947/8, that eventually led to their ethnic cleansing.
But we can all dream.
They also bombed the embassy in mandatory Palestine and were subsequently found hiding weapons and fighters in schools, hospitals and synagogues.
We can draw comparisons but the more you look the more they look the same.
You forget that Palestinians also have the right to defence, to self determination.
Imagine a world were Nazism didn’t spread like wildfire in Palestine in the 1930’s and NS movement didn’t commit porgroms like on Lake Tiberias. Welcome in a century long war started by supremacist, i assure its super fun. My country is btw a massive arms dealer do you want some so we don’t miss out on the funnies
Yeah, antisemetism is wrong, but so is Israel and apartheid. Israel is the one holding all the cards and killing the vast majortiy of babies, since this is the currency people care about now.
So the thing is: While the treatment of Palestinians in Israel proper does also constitute an Apartheid according to several organizations, I’m talking about the West Bank and Gaza here. Israel simply split Palestinians into different groups and subjects them to different levels of Apartheid. Palestinian Israelis are simply the people who were allowed oh so graciously by Israel to get the least bad level.
Also, your use of “mistreatment” is a massive understatement. Many people in high government positions in Israel want to ethnically cleanse Gaza.
See: https://thewire.in/world/israeli-government-population-transfer-gaza-strip
Do not downplay what Israel does by pretending it’s better than South African Apartheid.
Yeah, to use the term apartheid is not accurate to explain the atrocity. Don’t overplay ‘apartheid’, it’s not the accurate term. We need a stronger term here; could be zionistheid or Israelitheid.
I’ve heard the term “Nakba” suggested as a name for the brand new crime against humanity Israel created.
yeah. but the term haven’t got much traction outside of the Arabic-speaking populations.
it also, if I recall well specifically refer to an historical event aka the 1948 expulsion and often subsequent slaughters
Yeah. That’s what I got to know and realize how ignorant I’ve been, learning tha the atrocity was a well executed plan, formulated since more than125 years ago, and the Arabs never knew what was coming.
Anyway thanks to the British, the unsung culprit who taught and set the examples for the Israeli in their coming genocide. I used to think how cruel it is for the Israeli to demolish entire houses of any Palestian suspects or those they found to be guilty. Then. I learned that during the 1936-39 Arab Palestinian revolt, the British would demolish any Arabs’ houseswhere they could find even just one bullet, rendering them to be insurgents. The British severe campaign shut the revolt to the core and left the Arabs incapable of defending themselves in 1948. And the Arabs have suffered time and time again until now. Again, thank to the British.
or you have pogrom, or ethnic cleansing which is what it is
Not really. Ethnic cleansing (or in less flattering terms genocide) is the ultimate goal of the Nakba, but the current state of Palestinians can’t really be summed up as ethnic cleansing. Basically the Nakba isn’t just what happened in 1949, but also the state Israel forces the Palestinian people to exist in to this day.
yep, they’ve been before being exchanged
Isreal is the terrorist of the human race.
Sounds like you thought that Hitler didn’t go far enough with “exterminating the jews” by calling all Jewish people nazi terrorists
This whole “associating a group of people with a government/country” thing is kinda fucking whack. Your everyday jew is not going to be celebrating the shit Israel does any more than your average Palestinian will celebrate Hamas’ doings. Why the fuck would you imply antisemitism on the very notion of criticizing a government that oppresses its neighbors and steals their land? OP didn’t even mention jewish people, they mentioned Israel specifically. Israel doesn’t speak for all Jewish people, just like Hamas doesn’t speak for all Palestinians.
Israel is their ‘promised land’. It is more about religion than people would like to admit.
And while I agree there are a fair amount of Jewish people that are essentially like lapsed Catholics and Christians that don’t buy the full text word of the Bible/Torah, it is essentially wrong to argue that it is NOT a part of their religion when it absolutely IS.
As a general piece of advice, don’t build your religious land on the mass graves of the native population after you massacre them.
Wait are you saying that all Jewish people are Israeli?
Well, is the poster up there saying that all Israelis are terrorists?
Conversely, what would saying “Palestine is the terrorist of the human race imply?” That some Palestinians are terrorists? That many Palestinians are terrorists? That all Palestinians are terrorists?
Well one thing that differentiates is how spread out ethnic Jewish people are, like there are almost as many Jewish people in the US as there are in Isreal, no other ethnicity is spread like that AFAIK.
Sure. Equating Israel with all Jews is just as wrong as equating the state of Israel with all those living within it.
Kay? Somegeek didn’t equate israel with all jews, or all those living within it?
And I never said that, either. I was asking whether or not somegeek was equating Israel with all Israelis, since they didn’t make a distinction (e.g. by saying “the state of Israel” or “the IDF” or “the Netanyahu administration”).
Seems fair in light of the broad statement made by somegeek.
I think describing Israel as a terrorist state because it uses terrorist tactics is totally valid.
I’m not defending the tactics used by the Israeli military.
At the same time, they’re using tactics that are pretty similar to the tactics used by the United States in Iraq and in Afghanistan - yet even back then, despite all the opposition took America’s military interventions, we didn’t see people around the world claim that America was committing genocide or that America was s terrorist state.
Yet those labels are constantly applied to Israel.
Why do you think there’s this difference?
Just because no one said that about America doesn’t mean this one isn’t genocide. Just because one nation got away with it in the past does not make this any less genocide than it is.
Most likely the difference is political. No one could stand in the face of the US when it bombed Iraq, but it’s 2023 now and we know better. It took decades to build a strong case against genocide in Israel. It’s not a word people toss around lightly.
Just because no one said that about America doesn’t mean this one isn’t genocide. Just because one nation got away with it in the past does not make this any less genocide than it is.
That’s right.
However, if incredibly different standards are being used depending on the nation in question, that certainly raises suspicions that people are not actually criticizing the act (a military intervention to combat a terrorist organization), but rather the nation itself.
If two countries can have the exact same experience (a terrorist attack that killed hundreds of its citizens), react to that in the exact same way (a military intervention determined to root out there terrorist organization at any cost, willingly accepting that thousands of civilians are being killed as “collateral damage”), but one gets accused of committing genocide while the other one gets celebrated (remember “Mission Accomplished” or the spontaneous celebrations when bin Laden was killed?), doesn’t that warrant the question why identical actions get treated so differently?
It took decades to build a strong case against genocide in Israel. It’s not a word people toss around lightly.
America occupied Iraq and Afghanistan for decades. Why wasn’t the same “strong case” never built against America? Why are people accusing Israel of genocide for killing thousands, but nobody has ever bothered accusing America of genocide for causing the deaths of hundreds of thousands?
You say that America is to powerful, that nobody could stand in it’s way - but that shouldn’t have stopped human rights organizations from saying that America is committing genocide, that shouldn’t have stopped the UN from accusing America of genocide, that shouldn’t have stopped people to demonstrate in the streets with Iraqi or Afghan flags demanding “free Afghanistan.”
Why did none of that happen?
Man imagine someone seeing Nazi being used as an insult and turning around to demand why that person likes the Nazis so damn much
Just purging those of a different rac/ethnicity. Nothing to see here said the Germans, I mean Israelites.
Nothing to see here said the
GermansNazis, I mean Israelites.Your point is clear, but as a Dutchie, refusing to separate Nazis from Germans is a slap in the face of all the people who’ve tried to make up for it or were born afterwards.
So, fixed it for you.
heck some Germans even tries to fight the Nazis, and sure, they paid for it, but they tried
Why are they arresting citizens of Israel when their enemy are insurgents in Gaza?
It’s only confusing if you accept the framing that their enemies are only hamas militants.
I can’t help but wonder what Isreal is doing to these prisoners to need such a consistantly high number of men, women and children (that they call sub-human animals) at hand.
We already know Isreal steralises black jews and stole shephardic babies from their mothers to rehome in ashkenazi fanilies. And that Isreal tests weapons on the remaining Palestinian territories and Gaza.
Are the imprisoned Palestinians really only there to be starved, raped and beaten by the guards and to break the moral of the unimprisoned Palestinians?
Because at this point I would not be surprised if we start hearing of a new virus or sterility or something equally as fucking Mengeler being reported from Gaza in the next few weeks/months.
(Just re-read this and had to reword a section as I realised I wrote ‘Palestinian settlements’ and as it’s their fucking country and the Isrealis are the settlers, that is not a phrase I want to consciously use.)
Because at this point I would not be surprised if we start hearing of a new virus or sterility or something equally as fucking Mengeler being reported from Gaza
sadly its unlikely it will come from Tel Aviv, Teheran is
much more advanced in that domain
Who thaught trying to exchange your fighters against the other sides childrens would backfire ?
If you are a human being and not a bot, please get outside of your propaganda bubble and educate yourself. Israel’s “prisons” are today’s concentration camps, holding thousands of women and children without charges and evidence, not just “fighters.”
If Israel’s behaviour is not collective punishment (in contravention of international law), then answer why the IDF has even kept the dead bodies of their Palestinian hostages in numbered graves or refrigerators instead of returning them to their families. Answer why Israelis have been livid with Netanyahu’s administration. Even if they don’t fully see eye to eye with the rest of the world on this, even many Israelis understand the Netanyahu gov’t, settlers, and the IDF are the ones doing the most to put innocent Jewish people in the way of harm.
Answer why Israelis have been livid with Netanyahu’s administration
I’m spending my whole fucking time telling privileged glorified nazis that no one loves that fucker back there ! Mostly because if his shit go on i’ll have to attend the funerals of many friends because he dragged them in his mess and have been doing that for all of his office ! I know that. That’s everything I’m telling. The problem is that most of the time when I start to agree with some internet people on that they immediately try drag me to : “you should be glad they’re gonna kill your friends”.
Meanwhile I see “pro-palestinians” repeating actual IDF propaganda lines. And behaving EX-ACT-LY how the Likud NEED you to behave because their only goal, is exactly the same as the HAMAS : to continue that war as long as possible.
And I’m in a state of fucking despair BECAUSE EVERYONE ON EARTH DECIDED TO BE FUCKING DUMBASS AND TAKE THE ROAD THAT WILL KILL A MAXIMUM OF PEOPLE IN THE MOST EFFICIENT WAY !
So wake the fuck up. Don’t listen to the Likud. Don’t listen to the HAMAS and stop repeating their bullshits.
Even if they don’t fully see eye to eye with the rest of the world on this, even many Israelis understand the Netanyahu gov’t, settlers, and the IDF are the ones doing the most to put innocent Jewish people in the way of harm.
And can you guess why the hell is that. Why is the world blind to the fact that benny has less support the Emmanuel Macron. Because Nethanyahu greatest victory was to not only successfully lies to his allies but also to his ennemies.
If you would like to see peace happen, then for a start, reject ALL of Likud’s divisive and harmful lies and propaganda. You’re repeating it yourself with the woefully inaccurate and incredibly politically charged terms of exchanging “fighters” for “children” framing. Palestinians-- many of whom are literal children-- are just being rounded up wholesale, including in the West Bank where Hamas doesn’t exist. How can you call them “fighters” without charges, without evidence, without a trial… only on the word of the same IDF whose members have been proudly posting videos of their own war crimes? Wasn’t it supposed to be never again for anyone?
Oh it’s aljazeera. They’re just straight up pro Islam propaganda lately.
Here’s an article from HumanRightsWatch on the general situation: https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/11/29/why-does-israel-have-so-many-palestinians-detention-and-available-swap
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lately ?
