Was reading on the Renault Zoe subreddit about fitting an Inverter because this Car has No V2L, and i thought about that in the past but never did it because why throw Money at Something where i can’t think of usecases other than ‘it would be neat’. So to the people who have V2L, what are you using it for?
I guess there’s two kinds of V2L isn’t there?
There’s the “we put an electrical outlet on your car so you can plug things into your car” type of V2L. That just seems kind of gimmicky to me but I could see it being nice while going camping, except I never go camping. Plus it seems like you could just buy a 12v to 120v inverter, hook it up to the 12v accessory battery, then turn on the car so it keeps the accessory battery topped up.
Then there’s the other V2L. The one that’s supposed to be a game changer. The one that runs everything in your home automatically whenever your power goes out. The one where you can have it fill up the car battery overnight when your power costs are cheap, and then run the home off of the car during the day when the power costs are expensive. I know the Ford Lightning was supposed to be able to do this but I don’t think they ever got anywhere with it. Are there any cars on the market that do this?
- V2L Vehicle To Load - is that Outlet on your Car but Not truly bidirektional even If the same Port ist used with an adapter
Bidirektional types are
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V2H Vehicle To House - is where you can use your Car as a solar storage battery but only for your House.
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V2G Vehicle To Grid - is where the Car is used for grid stability and your Car Powers parts of your neigbourhood.
To be fair (and pedantic! 😁) the first kind is V2L (Vehicle to Load), the second is V2H (Vehicle to Home) or V2G (Vehicle to Grid).
And yes, Ford “got somewhere” with V2H on the F-150 Lightning if you buy their bi-directional charger and a transfer switch (to isolate the house from the grid during power outages protecting linemen from being hurt when repairing the grid.)
The first type can still be useful if you have a transfer switch or just need it for power outages. But yes, I think vehicle to home tech overall is going to become a huge part of EVs.
I used it to power my refrigerator while my electrical panel was being upgraded.
I’ve used V2L in several power outages to keep my fridge, freezer, fish tank and wifi running, along with some lights and charging laptops.
I’ve also used it to run power tools when out and away from any outlets. Most recently an angle grinder, but have run a table saw and circular saw as well.
Can also run a shop vac for cleaning the car.
This is all from the v2l adapter I purchased for my Ioniq 5.
It’s funny but running the shop vac when cleaning the car is super convenient. We get 4-5 power outages a year in the West Coast of Canada so v2l is awesome for those 5+ hours. I’m also assuming we’re going to get a more serious outage that lasts days, in the winter without heat it could get uncomfortable.
I dont know if one exists yet but if ex90 in US supports 240v output via V2L, I will use the car as my generator in the rare cases we lose power in winter.
I can also see it being useful in camps etc.
I’m only slightly jealous of your 240v support. 😉
The problem with that is battery life. Most things using 240v will drain you fast.
Some Renault Zoes were modded to Support V2G in a trial Run for grid stability. The Stock charger is able to Work with 3x32A at 400V (22kW) or 1x 32A at 230V (7.4kW) in either direction. All i know it is just a Software Thing , sadly this was never implemented in the normal Models you could buy, so only Up to 22kW charging for me.
It is not about using 240v devices, it is about being able to power both phases of the house. Otherwise we don’t run any 240v device while on generator really (AC, oven, dryer etc)
240V won’t power both phases of your house unless it supplies two split phase 120V legs like US utilities. 240V alone would only power 240V-only appliances like an electric stove, (or, ironically, a 240V EVSE.)
I am in US :) so if a vehicle here supports 240v with V2L it would for sure be one with a nema 14-50 outlet or similar with two 120v hots.
No, NEMA 14-50 outlets have two 240 hots and one neutral that divide the 240 service into two 120Vs (each “side” uses one hot and the neutral. EVs typically only provide two hots (no neutral) so they output either 240V only or 120V only. A 240V EV output would lack the necessary 120V neutral.
That doesn’t make sense to me so a source would really be nice. For example ioniq 5 V2L adapter has a regular US outlet where one is hot (120v), one is neutral and other is ground. There must be a neutral for it to work.
If you are saying they can only have one hot, then I can understand nema 14-50 not working but I am pretty sure it can be solved with additional equipment. There are already bidirectional chargers that I would be fine with purchasing as long as there is a standard.
Todd’s wrong. A 14-50 has two 120 V hots to ground and neutral. They are out of phase so you get 240 V between the two 120 V hots.
240V tools and appliances don’t necessarily use more power. They can but for the same output power the efficiency should be better with less losses to heat.
We had electrical work here in the street, cutting power to the house.
I used the V2L to power my work computer and internets.
Answers are:
- power outages
- tools
- camping
- store your solar energy (house battery)
- stabilizing the grid, with payment
Which is why I don’t see any use case for myself and most others in Europe:
- power outages are non-existent
- don’t use tool at any location where there isn’t an outlet, most of my tools run on batteries btw
- don’t go camping in the wild. Camp sites have electricity outlets.
- don’t have solar (house orientation is wrong & small roof)
- stabilizing the grid for payment isn’t an issue yet.
You can’t really use V2L for a house battery or grid stabilization, you need V2H/V2G for that, and from what I understand, vehicles like the Kia EV6, can’t be used with V2H or V2G chargers.
Actually, some Lightning owners ARE using V2L instead of the V2H setup to power their homes. Just plug in to the 240v outlet via a cheap generator transfer switch.
Yeah, Same Here and some extra thoughts from my side
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I honestly can’t remember the last Power outage other than a blown fuse.
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even with solar, i’m leaving in the morning when the sun rises, Car sits in a random parking lot with the sun blasting on it, i’m returning home when the sun sets… Other than three months in the Summer this is a useless Feature unless you are working nightshift or you are exclusively working from Home. It would be nice If it is able to do this but i wouldn’t pay extra for it.
We get power outages at our cottage sometimes. But it’s pretty much always during winter storms so we aren’t there anyway. It’s also on an island so no way to get the car there anyway.
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Just in my garage I have a fridge and tankless water heater that would benefit from V2L in a blackout. Within easy extension cord reach I also have my modem, router, and TV. My EVs could easily keep these essentials running for a week or two, and indefinitely if charging is available somewhere nearby.
That tankless is a power suck. Even worse, mine is a 240v. A conventional water heater is probably better in an emergency because it will hold the heat like a “battery” itself. That’s the only “regret” I have in going with one.
But down here in SWFL, it’s kind of moot. The power goes off, the water goes out too.
Mine is gas, but still needs power for the igniter and the fan. It is a lot more efficient than constantly keeping a tank of water hot, and it never runs out.
My bad for assuming heat source. I’m “all electric”: stove, clothes dryer, water heater, AC (so technically “heater” too). Without solar (condo board won’t allow), I can’t run my whole house. Even with solar, I’d probably need stationary batteries too.
Nothing
I don’t have a garage, so instead of running a long extension cord to an outlet, I use the V2L to plug in my vacuum and clean the car out once a month.
Instead of paying thousands to run power to our cabin, we just had a transfer switch installed and use the Hyundai as a generator
Is it… all downhill back from your cabin?
Coffee pot
Before we had our solar installed and they day of having it wired in. We used it to keep the fridge cold and the Internet going. As well has my husband’s computer for work. Randomly we have used it to air up friends tires when they had flats in remote spots. But lately it’s not been used at all.
My V2L got me through Hurricane Ian very well. I kept my fridge, freezer and internet going for 5 days. Halfway through, I could disconnect, drive to a DCFC 35 miles away to recharge fast enough to get back home before anything warmed up.
I had to sleep in the car (too hot inside and I have a CPAP) so I drained faster. Since then, I’ve wired in a “generator” transfer switch to my main breaker. I can keep the ceiling fan and outlets in my bedroom powered now too.
This is the way
I have a setup somewhat similar to this but I had the usual generator line. I had hooked about 500 watts in solar panels and 2kWh in batteries to an inverter and could run several things in my house during the day. With the V2L I just use the car during the day and the system I described at night.
Damn. What about us who live in a place with no natural disasters. It snows a bit but that’s about it.
I feel left out.
Go camping. Or probably “Glamping” with all the comforts of home.
You should consider adding an additional battery to keep your fridge running while you charge your EV.
There won’t be anyone home to open the fridge. A closed refrigerator will hold the temperature for four hours. Half hour to Naples (or Port Charlotte if the hurricane hits south of me), half hour to charge, half hour home. Plenty of time.
Sure, but adding off grid storage usually isn’t a bad idea.
You also never know if you’ll get slowed down between charging and returning home by inclement weather.
The batteries would need to go on an external wall or a wall in common with another unit so they’d need “architectural” and “safety” approval from the HOA. That’s not likely since I don’t have any statute to force their approval. I might be able to sneak the battery onto the common wall which is technically exterior but hidden by a fence and screen enclosure. They’d figure it out eventually though and make me remove it.
At least the “inclement” weather I’d face down here never comes back-to-back. Hurricanes take a few weeks to “recharge” too 😉
My ioniq 5 has V2L but to be honest, I haven’t had a chance to use it. I just like that it’s there though just in case!
Powering our induction hot plate when camping, mostly.