• Ysysel@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    If we take into consideration the destruction of the ecosystems necessary to sustain human life, capitalism is a net-negative.

    • postmateDumbass@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      They draw the box around the part that is a net positive.

      The destruction of the Commons is not accounted for.

      The impacts outside their box are not accounted for.

      • w2qw@aussie.zone
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        1 year ago

        This is true but not a necessity of capitalism. Pigouvian can put the destruction of the commons back in that box.

    • infotainment@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      That’s the tragedy of the commons, and you’ll find it’s true for basically every possible societal organization.

      • orrk@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        the tragedy of the commons was a bit of British aristocrat propaganda to take the land peasants worked…

    • EhList@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      If we consider the USSR and China were/are behind colossal ecological disasters of their own making, for example the near totall loss of the Aral sea or the Three Rivers Dam, we might have to realize it’s industrial nations over consuming resources that is the real problem.

    • nomadjoanne@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      Incredible that you can say that seriously. Human development and civilization causes ecosystem destruction. The particular economic system may affect the specifics of how this happens not whether or not it does.

      • Ysysel@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        Capitalism means always looking for more profits. Endless efforts of private owners to expand and increase their profits leads to the perpetual circle of suproduction and overconsumption which destroy ressources and ecosystems.

        This particular system is the main reason it’s happening.

        • havokdj@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          Do you honestly think a communist or socialist society which is wealthy would be any healthier for the environment than a capitalist one that is also wealthy?

          We have been destroying the planet long before economy was a concept.

          • Ysysel@lemmy.world
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            1 year ago

            A socialist or communist society could be healthier. Not saying it automatically would be. The only people theorizing a sustainable economy are on the (far) left though.

            And the last 50 years proved that sustainability is impossible in a capitalist system. It hinders profits, and the basis of capitalism is: always more profits.

            • EhList@lemmy.world
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              1 year ago

              The basis of capitalism is the least amount of government intrusion possible.

              • Ysysel@lemmy.world
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                1 year ago

                Well… no. It never was. Even the USA is highly intrusive and protectionnist. Also, state capitalism ? In you other responses you talk about China like it’s not a capitalist country. China is the main example of state capitalism.

                I think you are confusing capitalism with something else.

                The wikipedia article is a good start if you are interested.

                • EhList@lemmy.world
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                  1 year ago

                  State capitalism is a bullshit excuse that ML’s came up with why every IRL attempt at socialism fails.

                  China has not always been nearly as market driven especially from the late 80s and earlier. They loosened in the 1990s just like India did. Does this get taught in modern history? That’s a serious question as high school was before these events.

                  Finally if you think wikipedia is a good source you are in no position to be determining how educated on a subject the other person is. If wikipedia really covers the extent of your knowledge on a subject then you really only know the basics. I’d suggest starting with Mankiew’s Intro texts found on the open seas as those will give you an actual basic understanding of modern economics.

                  • Ysysel@lemmy.world
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                    1 year ago

                    Ahah ! So you just change the definition of a word to make it fit your worldview. And yes wikipedia is not a great source but it usually cover the basic stuff. I gave you the link to get you started but I see you’re not interested in educating yourself about the subject.

                    I mean, again, you think capitalism mean limited state intervention. It does not. By definition.

                    I’ll let you in you own world with your own words and custom definitions !

          • w2qw@aussie.zone
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            1 year ago

            A socialist society would be better for the environment because all the people would starve /s

        • EhList@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          Yet China is responsible for one of the greatest intentional ecological disasters of the last 50 years.

          It isn’t the economic system. It is large entitled industrialized populations that are the issue.