Thanks to Meter for sponsoring this video! Go to http://meter.com/ltt to book a demo now!It is time to Try Linux ONE MORE TIME. Linus, Luke, and Elijah all s...
Think of him what you want, but I think this nicely shows the problems that “gamers” will encounter when switching to linuxand gives a good view from outside the Linux community
That was a combination of the Steam client being a piece of trash (incredible complexity and technical debt*) and COSMIC. COSMIC is quite buggy when it comes to Xwayland. I’ve had plenty of issues where I close a Xwayland window, but a ghost of the window remains.
the Steam Client runs on a combination of Ubuntu 12.04 LTS and Debian 12 libraries. It has a combination of their old VGUI code and newer Chromium GUI. It remains 32-bit and only supports X11.
runs on a combination of Ubuntu 12.04 LTS and Debian 12 libraries.
No wonder it works fine in Ubuntu. Why won’t these “switch to Linux” challenges ever just fucking use Ubuntu?! It’s literally the distro that the big companies target!
I’ve found that Ubuntu still has by far the easiest one-click Nvidia driver installer of any distro, and switching between driver versions (such as rolling back if a new driver is buggy) is also far easier on Ubuntu.
I say that as someone who does not like Ubuntu in most other aspects.
funny that on Windows you have to update your drivers like this too, I see no issue with using a “slow” distro like Ubuntu for this, I have other reasons to avoid Ubuntu like snap packages
Have you heard the good news of our Lord and Savior, atomic Fedora versions? It’s even easier there because the driver is part of the image itself, and rollbacks are as easy as selecting a different entry in the boot manager.
It doesn’t work better or worse on Ubuntu. The fact it (partially) uses Ubuntu libraries matters very little given that the libraries are 14 years old… But I think the client now mostly relies on Debian 12 libraries to run since a year or two ago.
In this case, the DE is the main cause of issue, not the distro base.
That is 100% COSMIC jank. He chose Pop!_OS again and System76 has been annoyingly shipping a beta desktop environment on their stable distro.
I like COSMIC and System76, but this is an annoying decision by them and Linus does shitty research so he doesn’t know he’s running beta software and he’ll associate this with Linux being janky again 🙄
The average user trying to switch to Linux? YES, they would.
The average user like my mom? No, because she sure as shit doesn’t even know what Linux is nor how to make a bootable USB drive.
I’m sick and tired of this cop out answer of the “average” user.
This is like someone buying a car. Do you want to get a lemon? Sure, buy whatever “looks good” OR you do some RESEARCH and figure out what car to get from reliability reports.
Do you think a Mac user wanting to switch to Windows won’t do any research?
If you feel like you need to reinstall Windows anyway, Trying out Linux is a pretty low bar if you’re curious. In that situation I think everything Linus did seems plausible.
People who want linux usage to spread need to decide if they want widespread adoption (this comes with users who cannot troubleshoot and fix their own problems) or experts only (these people are already using linux)
Homie installed an alpha version of a distro instead of picking the stable one, ran into issues, something something picture of dude shoving a stick into the wheel of the bike he’s riding.
Pretending to be the average Joe to see what issues may occur certainly has it’s place - before an expert informs them of what they ought to do. That’s not to say people creating software cannot do better to appeal to the average user’s needs but it’s falls on experts to teach them to do tech right.
I mean, in the video, Bazzite was still showing how it’s not streamlined. I feel he was being too polite or dishonest so he doesn’t get cancelled by the Linux community. Sure, a couple of the situations were not Bazzite fault, but if it really was the year of the Linux, it shouldn’t be 10 hiccups from install to game. And that was still with his Linux experience.
if it really was the year of the Linux, it shouldn’t be 10 hiccups from install to game.
It isn’t 10 hiccups from install to game, if you just install something normal like Ubuntu or Fedora! The problem here is that the noobs are getting seduced by useless meme distros instead.
How did this idea that Fedora is a no-brainer beginner distro take hold?
Any distro that leaves it up to the user to install proprietary drivers and codecs via command line and then a chunk of additional software before anything can get done is not beginner friendly by today’s standards.
I’m a fairly advanced user of gnu Linux distros at this point in my life. Fedora is no where close to straightforward for gaming. Bazzite is plug and play set and forget. Is it frustrating to deal with flatpaks and osm-tree instead of simply using a standard package manager? Sometimes, sure. But for an absolute beginner there really is no better option for gaming as a fresh convert from windows.
Audio problems and nvidia drivers can be an absolute nightmare on almost all major distros from Debian to Ubuntu, to fedora if you don’t have an absurdly advanced grasp of the processes underlying.
Bazitte takes all of that out of the picture. It’s absolutely not a meme distro. It’s perfect for an average tech literate person.
I use arch btw, Debian, fedora, Pop, lubuntu, Ubuntu, and a half dozen other distros on a daily basis across a handful of devices. So I’m not daily driving Bazitte, but for gaming and general purpose computing there’s no simpler distro imo and I’ll die on that hill.
Apparently it is, given what happened in the video!
Linus’s problems in the video stem from him installing an Ubuntu based distro. His problems on Discord have been resolved in newer versions, which Ubuntu and Pop!_OS don’t ship with yet, while distros based on Fedora and Arch do. And guess what? I said to install Bazzite, a Fedora-based distro.
The other guy’s (not Luke) problem with screen scaling / framerate is mosy likely due to the HDMI forum refusing to allow support for HDMI 2.1 on Linux, limiting his bitrate. HDMI can’t do 4k/120+hz without that suppory
And the reason I’m calling you a prick is because you’re going through and whining that nobody is trying Ubuntu, when Ubuntu is not the right solution for them. Ubuntu doesn’t work for everyone’s use case. Get over it.
How is the average person going to know that? If Joe blow can’t easily get to the distro they “should be using”, Linux ain’t happening for most people.
Will do. He keeps damaging the reputation of the only real alternative to windows and he might be getting paid by Microsoft to do it. The last time he did this was fucking absurd. The terminal basically told him not to type a command unless he absolutely knew well what he was doing and he did it anyway. I will always maintain that if a user reads a lengthy and terrifying warning and then proceeds without any research, they have invited data and OS loss.
Think of him what you want, but I think this nicely shows the problems that “gamers” will encounter when switching to linuxand gives a good view from outside the Linux community
I have no idea what was up with the multiple steam windows, it did feel like he was actually cursed when that happened.
But the “weird control” issue in l4d2 which was then solved by using a custom launch command found on protondb… thats super real.
Eventually you learn to check protondb as a habit the second you encounter any kind of game issue but for a newcomer thats another hurdle.
Normally when I encounter a game issue I just put the game at the bottom of my MAAAAAAAASSIVE backlog.
That was a combination of the Steam client being a piece of trash (incredible complexity and technical debt*) and COSMIC. COSMIC is quite buggy when it comes to Xwayland. I’ve had plenty of issues where I close a Xwayland window, but a ghost of the window remains.
No wonder it works fine in Ubuntu. Why won’t these “switch to Linux” challenges ever just fucking use Ubuntu?! It’s literally the distro that the big companies target!
Because Ubuntu is really slow to update, which means you might have to wait months for driver updates to play the newest games.
Also, a lot of people have Nvidia cards, and updating their drivers is a pain on Ubuntu.
Most gamers are best served by an Arch or Fedora based distro that can include Nvidia drivers automatically.
I’ve found that Ubuntu still has by far the easiest one-click Nvidia driver installer of any distro, and switching between driver versions (such as rolling back if a new driver is buggy) is also far easier on Ubuntu.
I say that as someone who does not like Ubuntu in most other aspects.
funny that on Windows you have to update your drivers like this too, I see no issue with using a “slow” distro like Ubuntu for this, I have other reasons to avoid Ubuntu like snap packages
Have you heard the good news of our Lord and Savior, atomic Fedora versions? It’s even easier there because the driver is part of the image itself, and rollbacks are as easy as selecting a different entry in the boot manager.
It doesn’t work better or worse on Ubuntu. The fact it (partially) uses Ubuntu libraries matters very little given that the libraries are 14 years old… But I think the client now mostly relies on Debian 12 libraries to run since a year or two ago.
In this case, the DE is the main cause of issue, not the distro base.
They did use Mint in a previous video, and in the comment field on Youtube there’s rumors he’ll be trying Kubuntu since Pop was so buggy.
That is 100% COSMIC jank. He chose Pop!_OS again and System76 has been annoyingly shipping a beta desktop environment on their stable distro.
I like COSMIC and System76, but this is an annoying decision by them and Linus does shitty research so he doesn’t know he’s running beta software and he’ll associate this with Linux being janky again 🙄
Would the average user “do research” better?
The average user trying to switch to Linux? YES, they would.
The average user like my mom? No, because she sure as shit doesn’t even know what Linux is nor how to make a bootable USB drive.
I’m sick and tired of this cop out answer of the “average” user.
This is like someone buying a car. Do you want to get a lemon? Sure, buy whatever “looks good” OR you do some RESEARCH and figure out what car to get from reliability reports.
Do you think a Mac user wanting to switch to Windows won’t do any research?
If you feel like you need to reinstall Windows anyway, Trying out Linux is a pretty low bar if you’re curious. In that situation I think everything Linus did seems plausible.
well yeah system76 is marketing their buggy distro I wouldn’t doubt some reddit user looked at the larping for POPOS and said “let’s try that distro”
People who want linux usage to spread need to decide if they want widespread adoption (this comes with users who cannot troubleshoot and fix their own problems) or experts only (these people are already using linux)
This falls under that category. He installed a linux distro, the distro is janky.
He set himself up for failure again with PopOS.
Cachy and Bazzite are much better choices by the other team members.
Homie installed an alpha version of a distro instead of picking the stable one, ran into issues, something something picture of dude shoving a stick into the wheel of the bike he’s riding.
Which is kind of the point of the video.
They explicitly said: they could get expert opinion and support.
But when you use a search engine as an everage joe to find what distro to install, popOS comes up a lot on those shit listicles sites.
Pretending to be the average Joe to see what issues may occur certainly has it’s place - before an expert informs them of what they ought to do. That’s not to say people creating software cannot do better to appeal to the average user’s needs but it’s falls on experts to teach them to do tech right.
I think the real point is that Pop!_OS (and most Ubuntu based distros) shouldn’t be recommended for gaming.
Maybe modern search engines are part of the problem here. A local computer geek can probably offer better advice (better “tech tips” if you will).
Yea I call it bad research. And Linus knows better!! He should take this more seriously than he did now. I don’t like this video.
I mean, in the video, Bazzite was still showing how it’s not streamlined. I feel he was being too polite or dishonest so he doesn’t get cancelled by the Linux community. Sure, a couple of the situations were not Bazzite fault, but if it really was the year of the Linux, it shouldn’t be 10 hiccups from install to game. And that was still with his Linux experience.
That PUBG fails, is clear. You just won’t have a good time with anti cheat based games like PUBG, Fortnite and the like.
Wanna play those? Stay on Windows or get a console. Just how it still is.
And problems with capture cards I would not book in the „normie“ camp, which on a basic level is the goal of this video series.
It isn’t 10 hiccups from install to game, if you just install something normal like Ubuntu or Fedora! The problem here is that the noobs are getting seduced by useless meme distros instead.
How did this idea that Fedora is a no-brainer beginner distro take hold?
Any distro that leaves it up to the user to install proprietary drivers and codecs via command line and then a chunk of additional software before anything can get done is not beginner friendly by today’s standards.
Agreed, but I’ve been seeing people recommending Arch as a first distro lately, so…
Well that’s just plain silly.
I’m a fairly advanced user of gnu Linux distros at this point in my life. Fedora is no where close to straightforward for gaming. Bazzite is plug and play set and forget. Is it frustrating to deal with flatpaks and osm-tree instead of simply using a standard package manager? Sometimes, sure. But for an absolute beginner there really is no better option for gaming as a fresh convert from windows.
Audio problems and nvidia drivers can be an absolute nightmare on almost all major distros from Debian to Ubuntu, to fedora if you don’t have an absurdly advanced grasp of the processes underlying.
Bazitte takes all of that out of the picture. It’s absolutely not a meme distro. It’s perfect for an average tech literate person.
I use arch btw, Debian, fedora, Pop, lubuntu, Ubuntu, and a half dozen other distros on a daily basis across a handful of devices. So I’m not daily driving Bazitte, but for gaming and general purpose computing there’s no simpler distro imo and I’ll die on that hill.
Removed by mod
Apparently it is, given what happened in the video!
Also, who’s the prick? I’m not the one making personal attacks.
Linus’s problems in the video stem from him installing an Ubuntu based distro. His problems on Discord have been resolved in newer versions, which Ubuntu and Pop!_OS don’t ship with yet, while distros based on Fedora and Arch do. And guess what? I said to install Bazzite, a Fedora-based distro.
The other guy’s (not Luke) problem with screen scaling / framerate is mosy likely due to the HDMI forum refusing to allow support for HDMI 2.1 on Linux, limiting his bitrate. HDMI can’t do 4k/120+hz without that suppory
And the reason I’m calling you a prick is because you’re going through and whining that nobody is trying Ubuntu, when Ubuntu is not the right solution for them. Ubuntu doesn’t work for everyone’s use case. Get over it.
How is the average person going to know that? If Joe blow can’t easily get to the distro they “should be using”, Linux ain’t happening for most people.
Will do. He keeps damaging the reputation of the only real alternative to windows and he might be getting paid by Microsoft to do it. The last time he did this was fucking absurd. The terminal basically told him not to type a command unless he absolutely knew well what he was doing and he did it anyway. I will always maintain that if a user reads a lengthy and terrifying warning and then proceeds without any research, they have invited data and OS loss.