Any critiques, desire for clarity, outright hatred, whatever have you. I will respond the best I can.
I know there’s been some blowback on some of the policy updates but it’s been difficult to really explain fully that the restrictive content policy is temporary, this community was very unmanaged for a time and it had to be reigned in somehow and with the limited tools at disposal the temporary policy changes were made.
Here’s a comment that also explains a little bit behind the decisions made recently as well.
For community mods, we have a community mod coord matrix group chat now. Feel free to DM about it.
Also, there’s another ongoing discussion regarding SFW communities on lemmyNSFW here.
Would love to see the photon UI deployed.
100%, we will implement it when we can :)
Yay!
Earlier this evening I tried to make a post on the Genshin Impact NSFW community and while I was able to upload my image I couldn’t make the post, I’d like send but nothing would happen. I left it for a couple of minutes, nothing. I tried remaking the post but same thing.
While I’m not sure if there’s anything that can be done about it, I really don’t like that I’m able to see who reported my content. By not having the reporters be anonymous, it leaves a gateway for people to be harassed by others for making completely legitimate reports.
I’m not sure how likely it is that a case like this has happened already, but as the community grows, we’re bound to see people who are here in bad faith.
Related to this subject – when a post by a moderator is reported, it ends up going to back to the same moderator to decide on it… when they are most definitely not a neutral party when their own possibly underage flat-chested anime schoolgirl post is reported.
Moderator reports should go to an unrelated third party to adjudicate.
Otherwise, in practice, moderators just resolve all the reports they don’t agree with.
I get the reasoning, but I do feel that the rules are Way too strict on artwork (as opposed to pics/video of real people) to an unprecedented level. I’d like to see that reevaluated to be more in line with what other sites that allow NSFW permit - if they were facing legal trouble over that content, then they would ban it too, so I think it’s pretty evident that they don’t.
In particular this whole concept of establishing a “canon age” for every character and disallowing aged-up art strikes me as much worse than simply disallowing any art that looks underage.
I’d also like some clarity on how broad this goes.
Is captioned-in non-consent dialogue also prohibited? What about live action scenes with actors who are verified 18+ but have no curves and look young? Original art with unspecified age? Monster girls from species that don’t even live to 18?
There’s a lot there and it’s above and beyond virtually anywhere else. If this is part of the idea of broad, temporary restrictions as an attempt to reduce the admin workload, really what it’s going to do is create a lot of little fires to stamp out when the focus needs to be on the things that will get the site shut down the fastest (obviously illegal content and DMCA violations). Best to keep it simple, and simple is following established standards. Even if it means allowing content admins personally don’t like.
I agree. These rules only increase moderator workload, which really only contributes to burnout when the moderation tools aren’t good.
One of my biggest gripes with Reddit as a platform is the overabundance of amateur models spamming every single subreddit with the exact same posts to shill their OnlyFans and Fansly profiles, even to the point of posting their content in irrelevant subreddits without consequence. It’s at the point where the admins have all but abandoned the 10% rule for self-promotion.
Will you be implementing a policy to ban self-promotion for profit (and keep communities like Gonewild purely for exhibitionists), or at least encourage professional content creators to actually interact with the community and not astroturf LemmyNSFW with adverts for their OF like they’ve done with Reddit?
I think it’s mostly up to the community moderators to determine whether or not they want that content and how they will police it. As long as it doesn’t break site rules (new rules and clarification coming soon) then it’s not really something we want to micromanage.
With that said, link spamming is def not ok. I’m open to suggestions on how we can build out the toolchain that can ensure a good quality of posts.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perceptual_hashing
Hash all the images in a separate table and make it searchable. It’s a lot of work but it also makes dealing with DMCA much easier as you can automate removal of obvious infringements and illegal content that’s spreading.
This is what killed nsfw on reddit. All these beautiful, niche subs. Destroyed by of spam. I wrote a bot that scanned a posters history, and if it found an of link, it flagged them. Of course it was banned on reddit.
I am quite time poor to learn a new bot language here at the moment but in time I could give it a crack.
OF spam kills communities.
Based on what evidence?
As a mod of many subs on Reddit, what I saw killed a lot of the subs over thepast year is the proliferation of spam accounts that repost popular posts indiscriminately within a sub (OC, seller, doesn’t matter) in order to advertise products/websites, etc via pinned posts on their profiles. Plus the Reddit admins allowing “viral” subreddits to spring up on a daily basis by these spam rings.
Most competent mods on legit subreddits knew how to use automod and verification tools to handle sellers, etc. What drove a lot of us mods to throw up our hands and close off subreddits is the fact that we got no support from admins to combat spam/spammers (not the same as sellers).
And of course, at the same time, Reddit banned a lot of long time experienced moderator accounts which then resulted in many niche subreddits to be banned due to lack of moderation. From my viewpoint, the culprit is not due to sellers.
[Addition] - Just old history for reference
I wrote a bot that scanned a posters history, and if it found an of link, it flagged them. Of course it was banned on reddit.
Haha - what a coincidence! I was part of the ones that reported to Reddit admins such bots like the one you wrote so that those bots would be banned 😉 (and they were)
[Addition] rip onlyfansdetectbot, https://imgur.com/LrQhZv6, Full album for related screenshots wrt bot - https://imgur.com/a/tfqTKLg
I wholeheartedly and respectfully disagree. I used to visit the communities, let’s say /r/assholebehindthong or something like /r/assontheglass. It was a true community full of people who were into that particular fetish. It was smaller, traffic was not as fast, but the posts were quality. Pure quality.
Now it’s a non stop stream of:
- do you like my (insert appendage)
- my husband won’t fuck me, will you?
- upvote for nudes in your inbox
- etc etc etc
Total clickbait spammy shit. You’ll visit a subreddit like /r/doublevaginal and you’ll get an OF spammer posting an image that has nothing to do with DV and a title like “would you like to double vag me?!”.
The subreddits have been laid waste to the scourge of OF spamming. I yearn for the days when the subreddits were actual, real people posting real, focused content. It’s done, it’s gone and it’s nearly 100% OF material that’s killed it.
I totally understand the frustration you and many others have. It’s easy to simply point at sellers and say they are the cause - its so convenient to scapegoat.
in my reply earlier, ive laid out some of my observations (over 5 years) about the decline. A sub/community’s health and success is almost totally based on the moderator teams and whether they actually care about what they are moderating vs if they just want to build/expand little fiefdoms for ego reasons. And believe it or not, the community members play a huge part in reporting and weeding out spam and keeping the playground clean if mods motivate them and take action on reports.
As mentioned, most of the usual clickbait can and is easily handled by automod as well as by moderators who can lay out a vision and set reasonable rules for the community, as well as judicious banning. Talented sellers know how to properly focus on what the community want and deliver (without the clickbait). As an example, I took over r/LabiaGW for a couple of years from the founder of sub and grew it from 100K to 500k in that time (with the help of a healthy mix of true amateurs AND verified responsible sellers). The clickbait sellers don’t last long beyond a few days and are easily banned/weeded out by the community.
Unfortunately, Reddit allowed (explicitly encouraged?) spamrings to flourish and exist because it needed the traffic from such to keep showing subscribers and traffic “growth” metrics (likely for advertising and planned IPO purposes). Mods had to spend majority of the time fighting THAT spam so couldn’t focus on actually “moderating” and cultivating the communities. Reddit also banned/removed a lot of such responsible mods (or some mods just threw up their hands at lack of inaction about spam from Reddit admins and left the mod teams), and then these subs got taken over by shady folks who purpose is simply to promote and actively provide forums for the spam stuff you mentioned. Try looking at various mods/rings that currently “operate” the subs full of the spam you abhor, vs the successful subs that remain relatively clean and are growing. Ask yourself why Reddit admins allow hese shady folks to flourish even when repeatedly reported, but actively seek out to remove ban responsible mods who do such reporting…
I hope Lemmy admins are reasonable and smart enough to recognize the true causes and don’t knee-jerk ban sellers.
Yeah but at this point they’re probably helping growth since they post so much actual content, so I think having a light hand towards them is beneficial. Still should be in the proper subs though.
there seems to be an issue with blocking communities. i’ve blocked a number of communities containing content i’m not interested in but they recently started showing up in the Local feed, such as https://lemmynsfw.com/?dataType=Post&listingType=Local&page=1&sort=New
deleted by creator
Did you know that, at least from my experience, the password reset link is not functioning. I was logged out for some reason, and couldn’t remember my password. Tried the “forgot password” with email address several times over a couple of days, never received an email. Fortunately, an extra neuron fired this morning and I remembered the password and was able to log in. :)
I’m having two issues with this instance while using a 3rd party app: Sync for Lemmy. Both issues are about blocking communities, and I don’t think either are the app’s fault.
Failing to record new community blocks
The Sync app fails to record a block when I use its “block community” button. This request either doesn’t reach the server, or the server is mishandling it. I get no error in the app, but when I check my block list on the website, the block is not there. This feature works fine on other instances.
Failing to apply community blocks
When viewing the instance in Sync, none of my community blocks work at all! I have 68 blocks, and as far as I can tell, none of them are working. I verified 5 that definitely are not, but its hard to know if I’m not seeing a community because a block is working, or I just haven’t scrolled far enough to see any posts in it.
On the other hand, when viewing the website, the blocks do prevent those communities from appearing in my feed. They just don’t block them in the feed the Sync app receives from the API. Blocks on other instances work fine when that instance is viewed in Sync.
So it seems like there are two bugs regarding blocks at the API level.
I am all for making sure for rules to be enforced, however…
I have been collecting images I like from the R site for however many years, and now, with a new site and community, I am ready to share the love.
I’ve started posting, but !tinytitties@lemmynsfw.com have been kind of unwelcoming. First, they asked for model consent on a post, which was promptly deleted anyway. No big deal, let’s choose something that doesn’t look like I want to share some revenge porn. Another one deleted, now I am banned for even subscribing.
The rules are not clearly specified. I’ve posted to some other communities with no problem, but there is no rule about having to provide source, consent, or OC name. This is something that has to be worked on a little.
I wanted to express that I’m extremely concerned about the banning of @paddedperson and the deletion of their thread saying that they were migrating away from lemmynsfw.
As far as I can tell, @paddedperson was banned for leaking preliminary information about upcoming content policy changes from the admin discussion group. In my view, they were legitimate concerns, and retaliatory action taken against him are very concerning with respect to treatment of whistleblowers.
Can admins comment on this incident?
Truly transparent non-profit organizations (e.g. Wikipedia) typically release meeting minutes (a summary or transcript), or allow the public to attend voting meetings as part of the audience. Can the admins provide a summary or transcript of the votes taken on various decisions?
So I’m not really an “admin” - I’m a sysadmin/developer who was given the role of admin so I can make sure all systems (including modlog, reportings, and other tools) work as we adjust them for this instance’s very specific needs.
Padded got banned because he was trying to sabotage the efforts of an entirely volunteer group including revealing our hosting provider. We are not a “non profit organization” - lemmynsfw is a volunteer instance being run on donations. People need to understand that this is no one’s “job” and yet it’s literally taking a ton of our time. I’ve spent so many hours pouring over lemmy code, system configurations, working with the mod tool group, brainstorming, writing code, and trying to help the real admins where I can…
And seriously, no one is being paid for this, donations barely cover server costs, and any excess donations are being saved because it’s anticipated that server costs will continue to rise while donations don’t. Besides, I don’t think any of us WANT to be paid for fear of reprisal from our respective governments for “making money” off serving pornography.
When the creator put out his call for help, a bunch of us stepped up to try to keep the server alive, but this is not an easy instance to run. Please understand that.
To be clear, the volunteers/admins at Wikipedia are not paid either. From my personal experience in Wikimedia communities, my sincere advice is to consider and take transparency seriously.
The most important resource in volunteer spaces like this is ‘trust’.
I hope you and the admin team recognize that in order to run a website like this, you also require the trust and buy-in from moderators (who are also unpaid) to invest the many hours into their communities just as you have done for the server. Hiding things from moderators, sending mixed messages, and making secret deliberations (with rumors that some admins are eager to remove large quantities of content) is really damaging for that relationship of trust.
The recent content policy changes (even before padded’s leak) have been dictatorial top-down decrees. However, these unilateral rule changes are impractical/meaningless when moderators have not agreed to enforce those rules – and I’ve personally experienced this (at best, only 30% of the content that I’ve reported for content policy violations have been addressed by moderators). Realistically, no moderator wants to enforce rules they don’t believe in, and if they leave, the departure of skilled talent cripples this website and leaves communities effectively unmoderated in practice.
Please consider improving the transparency of these content policy deliberations, and at the very minimum, incorporate community moderators into the discussion and ascertain that they are in agreement with the rules before rolling out changes on the drop of a dime.
It’s impossible to please everyone, tend to our jobs, and tend to our families and lives. Concessions will always be made. I don’t know how wikipedia handles all that, but I don’t see how we can do that.
There is a matrix channel for public lemmynsfw discourse, https://matrix.to/#/#lemmynsfw:matrix.org - there’s not a lot of activity there but if you have questions or want a more direct line with us, that’s where we are. We can make a mod specific room and invite folks to have a mod-centric discussion if you think that’s helpful.
But please, please, PLEASE remember that everyone is volunteering their time, and respect for one another is the most important part of this entire process.
I’m very understanding and sympathetic to the fact that running large communities is difficult.
My impression of the current situation is that trust is especially low between community mods/contributors and the admin team. The only way to repair that trust is through transparency, and I would suggest that your team implement as many measures as possible.
For example, mastodon.world discloses all of their finances.
Content banning and user banning processes need publicly posted procedures. How many warnings does each user get? What is the appeal process like? Banning of communities or users should never occur unless it is in violation of an existing policy. It is not okay to change the rules and ban simultaneously (e.g. as was done with c/scat or c/rapehentai). Instead, provide some advance notice. Ideally, suspend before banning. Provide the banned community or user with information about why they were banned.
In a situation like this, where there is so much wild speculation about the content policy, my honest opinion would just be to make the entire process transparent. For example, I used to write minutes for the mediawiki community I was in and sometimes I would publish saved IRC logs. Example minutes:
- Date
- User A submitted this proposal (linked)
- User B, C said X about the proposal
- User D said Y about the proposal
- The vote on this proposal was #-# (# did not vote)
- The proposal passed and will be implemented on future date Z
Although I suppose it was more important for our community to track all the minutes because we were a volunteer community with elected admins. However, for the situation that you are in, I really think it would be beneficial to pursue transparency to that degree.
I have been dealing with nonstop reports of non consent. As aparantly unless someone is actively holding a sign saying “I consented to this” signed and dated prior to the interaction it’s now rape.
For example this post has been reported for rape:https://lemmynsfw.com/post/101797
And a post continues to be reported for rape becouse “(in the anime) the character depicted would never have consented to this, therefore it’s rape”
The default position that everything is rape, unless explicitly stated makes running many types of communities impossible.
This is made worse as other people have pointed out (including me) that 62 percent of women seek out CNC content (including my wife).
I also still struggle with the canonical age limits… link and zelda are only above 18 in one game so I have been consistently responding to reports from the lost woods community sending links to game wikis showing that they are above age. It is also weird to me that 90 percent of anime characters are considered loli regardless of how they are drawn, and that I have to argue that characters like rem are from later seasons as otherwise they would also be banned.
Edit: one other note, some users have also informed me “a school uniform means that it’s loli” due to their understanding of the rules
I just lost my really long comment that I had written, so I’ll make it quick…
Can the admins please clarify?
- My understanding is that the non-con rule only applies to IRL non-con that happened and was recorded in media, not stuff is like drawings of fictional characters, correct?
- How do we identify non-con? So far I understood that to mean explicit rape play, where a person tells the other person to stop and they don’t, but it seems people are interpreting this rule far broader? What is your definition?
- What are the requirements for a “sauce with obvious context” that’s proofs that something is consensual? Their profile says that all their recordings are consensual? It’s a professional shoot with a company? It’s an official post from an OF/Fansly creator? What counts as proof?
On anime girls in school uniforms / school settings, my take is that it shouldn’t be allowed unless it’s known canonically that they’re 18+.
I realize from our discussions that you believe that school uniforms should be allowed unless it’s known that they’re canonically underage, but this leaves a huge gap in artist OC with unknown ages. Over the years, I’ve listened to many people throw up this defense like a shield (“Oh they’re just cosplaying! We don’t know their age but they’re definitely adults!”), kind of like the 1000-year-old loli shield, but current guidance from the admins suggests that they prefer a conservative approach.
I have to agree with @paddedperson. There have been several cases where I as a mod have been unsure if something should count as consensual, as it’s rarely just outright stated. It’s made me a bit hesitant to post certain things, myself. I’ve also had reports of characters being underage, but all of the reported content, except for one post, have featured original characters with no specified age that to me could very well be young adults, or the character(s) are maybe 17 in the beginning of a series (Legend of Korra), but are 21 or so by the end of the series. Even the post that did feature characters that were slightly underage was a bit unclear to me if it should have been removed bc it only featured softcore type porn of characters from a series with prevalent female nudity (Ranma 1/2). I did end up removing that one.
Rude.
Please don’t allow communities to ban sellers. I think not allowing advertising in the community itself makes sense. I shouldn’t get excluded for having a fan site though! It’s incredibly entitled to expect girls to post nudity with no way to profit off of it. Give the good talent a reason to post on this platform 💘💘💘
Give the good talent a reason to post on this platform
I totally agree with you. OC/seller talent is always welcomed at communities I moderate (with the exception of ones that are strictly studios/sites focused).
IMO, Reddit (and the subreddits I mod) benefited so much from the creative sellers.
I appreciate that 💘 On Reddit, some mods banned me for having a link in my bio on my own page. That seemed over the top to me.
I fully support your right to promote and make a living with your content. But there must be the possibility for people to create coms exclusively for exhibitionists that like to post for the thrill of it. These people has as much right to have a platform as you have. Mods are also literally working for free to keep coms safe, on topic and legal. Everyone should feel welcome on this site. (as long as they are following the rules and laws, of course) Let’s find a way to exist well alongside each other. :)
I’ll just chime in to say that while I have no problems with sellers (and all the amazing sex workers out there!), so many of these communities seem to be nearly overrun with people marketing content. I just want to be able to know when people are selling, and choose that kind of content, when it appeals to me.
Specifically, there’s an entirely different feel to for-profit porn versus for-excitement porn, and I, for one, am hoping for a little more space being made specifically for people in it for the fun - I’m thinking like /r/NoFans and /r/normalnudes for example.
I’ve always advised OC sellers to stay away from those subreddits and mod teams that run those fiefdoms (and I’m sure the same division lines will emerge here on Lemmy).
There are/will be many other welcoming places where you will be appreciated. And you can always create new vibrant communities yourself)
That’s fair. I read your site rules and I appreciate the emphasis on consent. I guess it was alarming to me to see that as a growing trend on Reddit & Reddit culture
I think the admins are trying to take a hands off approach to this overall to allow individual communities to establish the spaces they want. However i just wanted you to know that from the admins ive talked to we do really appreciate content creators and will keep an eye on it. and there have been comments in this post stating “we should ban all only fans creators” which i atleast wouldnt consider, and i havent heard any on the admin team seriously consider it.
If we see alot of communities start banning content creators overall (not just banning advertising, but full on banning posts from people with a paid platform in their bio/etc) we will revisit it, and try to make sure the space is as creator friendly as possible, however to a certain degree i wonder if it will naturally sort itself out as without content creators they arent exactly going to have content to grow yknow ?
Are there coms that are bothering you currently ? (cant promise things will change, but its good for us to pay attention to)
It would be nice if this platform was supportive of consenual creators vs banning them and allowing others to post stolen content. I just wanna have my link 😅
I don’t have any grievances with this platform. I have problems with Reddit and I’m hoping the culture is more consensual here 🫶🫶🫶
I don’t think there’s any intention of banning creators at all. In fact I think we’re open to advertising yourself and linking your sites, as long as you’re not intrusive or spammy…
edit: I should also add that the community mods are the ultimate deciders over the advertising aspect.
I’ve noticed, that when viewed through pornlemmy.com, communities have redgifs previews, but on lemmynsfw.com they are just links. Compare https://pornlemmy.com/c/cumsluts and https://lemmynsfw.com/c/cumsluts@pornlemmy.com
(You need to open them in web browser)
Can this be fixed?
I asked @yay@lemmynsfw.com a couple weeks ago about possibly having RedGifs links fully working with proper embedding (like on reddit). Not sure if the recent changes about the instance admins will have any impact on this kind of things, so I’m posting this just to check if it’s something that it’s still being worked on. Again, no rush :)
I’d definitely post more from there if the embed was as nice as e.g. using RES.
Very true. Currently Red gifs links are very cumbersome to view.
