Or just don’t pretend you’re sticking it to capitalism by helping them stiff their workers. You’re directly supporting the practice. You’re no fucking hero for not tipping, and the only people you’re sticking it to are the underpaid employees.
Trust me, as a vegan, i know how hard it is to research everything you consume or buy or purchase. You give up convenience to support a cause you care about or believe in, because those conveniences are exactly what feeds the problem. And trying to find stuff that isn’t contributing to the problem is way more expensive, because cruelty to animals or cruelty to your human minimum wage workers are exactly what makes your food so quick and easy and cheap.
As a general rule, i’d guess that if you don’t want to tip, but don’t want to support companies that don’t pay their wages well: give up cheap fast food. give up most large national or international chains. you’re probably looking at a lot more cooking for yourself from home, probably buying your food at a local small co-op. It’s not going to be easy.
That or tip well because the person taking your order is the person you’re fucking over by not tipping, not the people profiting.
Either way don’t pretend you’re doing anything other than supporting the problem.
What’s your solution to knowing which businesses pay their employees a fair wage? How do I know where to shop? Is there a website which catalogs this information?
My solution is to tip well, because not tipping is hurting the employee, not the employer. If they were paying the employees a fair wage, the prices would be higher anyway.
oh go fuck yourself. i make decent money normally, but i’ve also been in the position where im scraping by, and right now im much closer to the latter category, having been recently laid off.
I tip well when I can afford it, but if i can’t afford to do so, i don’t fucking go out. I’m not going to fuck over someone who makes a few bucks an hour before tip so that i can eat cheap food someone else made, im cooking from home now that im unemployed, and even once i have a job again it will be a while before i can indulge in that.
a lot of people seem to be missing my point in this thread, which is that you have a few choices here:
tip well, to support employees, because US tax laws allow you to pay someone a fraction of minimum wage if you can say they’re a tip-based worker, and even if you can’t just put up a tip jar and pay minimum wage
don’t go to places which rely on underpaying workers to give you cheap prices, because the cruelty is what makes it cheap
you live in an area where tipping is weird because everyone is paid well
don’t tip, because you can’t afford to
don’t tip, pay 100% of the employer’s asking price, and go brag on the internet about how you don’t tip and you’re sticking it to capitalism, while the only person you’re hurting is the employee.
Most of the above are fine. The second from last, if you have empathy for others, you’ll probably at least realize who you’re hurting, even if you can’t help it.
That last one though just makes you a certifiable piece of shit. You’re not cool for fucking over the little guy and calling it sticking it to the man.
I don’t. I actually live in a country where tipping is not customary. Now let’s talk about your problems… Why do you assume the worst in people? You could have said the exact same thing without attacking everybody.sThe world is a large place and things are not always like they are in your neighborhood
This argument is strange to me, because super-wealthy people don’t pollute just because they can. They do it because it’s profitable…and it’s profitable because people buy their products.
“It’s your fault I’m killing the environment because even though I know my products are killing the environment, you keep buying them so why should I change anything?”
Yeah that sounds exactly like the corporate propaganda I see everywhere
I agree with socialism, but I disagree with how many socialists think it’s a panacea to everything bad about society.
Pollution? Socialism.
Racism? Socialism.
Sexism? Socialism.
Homophobia? Socialism.
I’ve never yet heard a plan for converting a capitalist country, any capitalist country, to socialism. Yet we’re supposed to abandon whatever cause we’re fighting for and instead bang the drum for socialism, because that will solve everything.
It could be argued that, if the economy works in a non-hierarchical way, there are less difficulties to break down some forms of historical social discrimination. This is because, if wealth has historically accumulated in the hands of some white people (for example), those rich people might want to promote racist divisions to frame social issues in a way that their excessive wealth and power doesn’t receive much attention. However you’re absolutely correct in that ending capitalism is not a guarantee to solve sexism, racism, homophobia or ableism. You can look at historical examples of genuine attempts to achieve socialism, such as 1938 Catalonya, and while you might find them more socially progressive than their contemporary neighbours, we wouldn’t say that they had views on gender equality particularly impressive to today’s eyes.
Pollution is a somewhat different issue. Due to capitalism’s need to constantly expand (lest it degenerates into feudalism), it is going to constantly fight any and all attempts to regulate the exploitation of natural resources, and a lot of society is going to feel incentivized to go along with it because it looks like a good short-term solution to economic emancipation to a lot of people. Still, you could also end capitalism and find that the system you replace it with still has difficulties to curtail pollution, due to different reasons.
“can’t solve the problem as long as capitalism exists, so may as well contribute to capitalism while patting myself on the back and pretending i’m sticking it to the man by helping them exploit workers” is such fucking bullshit. “i can’t change the world so may as well contribute to the fucked up” is exactly what keeps the practice sustainable.
you are only contributing to wage theft by deciding you’re a hero for not tipping.
if you want to try in other ways to make effective change in society? go for it. do that too. but don’t hit no tip and then go jerk off publicly over how sexy you are for fighting capitalism.
Of course, it is common sense when entering an establishment for the first time to do a business model analysis to see if the employees are getting shafted.
He means it’s not up to him to make sure the person serving him makes a decent wage. That’s up to the employer.
Everyone who works for a company is a ‘slave’ we are all being exploited, some more than others. But if you make less than minimum wage without tips then yes maybe look for another job.
That is not my problem. In this day and age where prices if food have gone through the roof, sorry, but I usually search for the cheapest place there is. I have a fixed income as well.
Then don’t go to businesses that don’t pay their employees a fair wage. Don’t just handwave it away while contributing to the problem.
How do one know that?
“May i take your order sir?”
“What’s your hourly wage?”
Research the company.
Or just don’t pretend you’re sticking it to capitalism by helping them stiff their workers. You’re directly supporting the practice. You’re no fucking hero for not tipping, and the only people you’re sticking it to are the underpaid employees.
Trust me, as a vegan, i know how hard it is to research everything you consume or buy or purchase. You give up convenience to support a cause you care about or believe in, because those conveniences are exactly what feeds the problem. And trying to find stuff that isn’t contributing to the problem is way more expensive, because cruelty to animals or cruelty to your human minimum wage workers are exactly what makes your food so quick and easy and cheap.
As a general rule, i’d guess that if you don’t want to tip, but don’t want to support companies that don’t pay their wages well: give up cheap fast food. give up most large national or international chains. you’re probably looking at a lot more cooking for yourself from home, probably buying your food at a local small co-op. It’s not going to be easy.
That or tip well because the person taking your order is the person you’re fucking over by not tipping, not the people profiting.
Either way don’t pretend you’re doing anything other than supporting the problem.
What’s your solution to knowing which businesses pay their employees a fair wage? How do I know where to shop? Is there a website which catalogs this information?
Ask the employees whether they feel that they’re being treated well and paid correctly?
They can’t exactly answer that honestly.
Why not? No freedom of speech in the USA?
My solution is to tip well, because not tipping is hurting the employee, not the employer. If they were paying the employees a fair wage, the prices would be higher anyway.
Found the employer
oh go fuck yourself. i make decent money normally, but i’ve also been in the position where im scraping by, and right now im much closer to the latter category, having been recently laid off.
I tip well when I can afford it, but if i can’t afford to do so, i don’t fucking go out. I’m not going to fuck over someone who makes a few bucks an hour before tip so that i can eat cheap food someone else made, im cooking from home now that im unemployed, and even once i have a job again it will be a while before i can indulge in that.
a lot of people seem to be missing my point in this thread, which is that you have a few choices here:
Most of the above are fine. The second from last, if you have empathy for others, you’ll probably at least realize who you’re hurting, even if you can’t help it.
That last one though just makes you a certifiable piece of shit. You’re not cool for fucking over the little guy and calling it sticking it to the man.
Your ‘solution’ is to tip well which is just giving in to the fucked up american system and supporting companies that exploit their staff.
I tip but only as a thank you if the service was good. It’s up to the restaurant to calculate those costs into their pricing.
I don’t. I actually live in a country where tipping is not customary. Now let’s talk about your problems… Why do you assume the worst in people? You could have said the exact same thing without attacking everybody.sThe world is a large place and things are not always like they are in your neighborhood
https://www.marxist.ca/article/why-there-is-no-ethical-consumption-under-capitalism
You even linked the dogma!
This argument is strange to me, because super-wealthy people don’t pollute just because they can. They do it because it’s profitable…and it’s profitable because people buy their products.
“It’s your fault I’m killing the environment because even though I know my products are killing the environment, you keep buying them so why should I change anything?”
Yeah that sounds exactly like the corporate propaganda I see everywhere
I agree with socialism, but I disagree with how many socialists think it’s a panacea to everything bad about society.
Pollution? Socialism.
Racism? Socialism.
Sexism? Socialism.
Homophobia? Socialism.
I’ve never yet heard a plan for converting a capitalist country, any capitalist country, to socialism. Yet we’re supposed to abandon whatever cause we’re fighting for and instead bang the drum for socialism, because that will solve everything.
It could be argued that, if the economy works in a non-hierarchical way, there are less difficulties to break down some forms of historical social discrimination. This is because, if wealth has historically accumulated in the hands of some white people (for example), those rich people might want to promote racist divisions to frame social issues in a way that their excessive wealth and power doesn’t receive much attention. However you’re absolutely correct in that ending capitalism is not a guarantee to solve sexism, racism, homophobia or ableism. You can look at historical examples of genuine attempts to achieve socialism, such as 1938 Catalonya, and while you might find them more socially progressive than their contemporary neighbours, we wouldn’t say that they had views on gender equality particularly impressive to today’s eyes.
Pollution is a somewhat different issue. Due to capitalism’s need to constantly expand (lest it degenerates into feudalism), it is going to constantly fight any and all attempts to regulate the exploitation of natural resources, and a lot of society is going to feel incentivized to go along with it because it looks like a good short-term solution to economic emancipation to a lot of people. Still, you could also end capitalism and find that the system you replace it with still has difficulties to curtail pollution, due to different reasons.
“can’t solve the problem as long as capitalism exists, so may as well contribute to capitalism while patting myself on the back and pretending i’m sticking it to the man by helping them exploit workers” is such fucking bullshit. “i can’t change the world so may as well contribute to the fucked up” is exactly what keeps the practice sustainable.
you are only contributing to wage theft by deciding you’re a hero for not tipping.
if you want to try in other ways to make effective change in society? go for it. do that too. but don’t hit no tip and then go jerk off publicly over how sexy you are for fighting capitalism.
Of course, it is common sense when entering an establishment for the first time to do a business model analysis to see if the employees are getting shafted.
Lol nobody cares. I won’t tip. I don’t care to know how an employer pays wages. Let me just eat. I’m also a slave, don’t look at me for salvation.
Don’t work there if wages aren’t paid fairly.
So don’t work at your job either if you’re also a wage slave? Maybe take your own advice?
He means it’s not up to him to make sure the person serving him makes a decent wage. That’s up to the employer.
Everyone who works for a company is a ‘slave’ we are all being exploited, some more than others. But if you make less than minimum wage without tips then yes maybe look for another job.
That is not my problem. In this day and age where prices if food have gone through the roof, sorry, but I usually search for the cheapest place there is. I have a fixed income as well.
Easier said than done if you ever want to eat out. So I just tip and grumble about it.
Or maybe don’t work at such a place? Don’t agree to an unfair deal. Quit. Force the employer to change.
Lol.Everyone thinks you’re dumb.