Also, what if there were like, large, space fairing celestial beings which might be biblical spirits or alien monsters in mech suits?.. And they can like, ninja around in space. The song might make more sense for them.

A meme I don’t think should be promoted right now, because it spread their picture around.

…now if we want to distort the image so it has someone else’s face, thus confusing the popular idea of what they look like - I’m all for that.

No, the onus of evidence is on you to show me this “early definition of Capitalism” that predates Marx. Although it seems if you’re claiming such, you simply didn’t read my comment.

If it was an accident, the accident repeated several times. Even engineers got murdered for correctly saying you shouldn’t overload trains (1).

Wow, you mean Authoritarian Communism is still Authoritarian? Yeah no shit (and as you can read from earlier I’ve already mentioned many such things happening under conditions of Capitalism, directly from the doctrines practices of cost cutting and wage theft or brutalization, but fine, “I’ll see your engineers there and raise you the British Bopal disaster” that killed and deformed generations of Indians in their home village and is still causing health effects today).

As you’ve dropped in I’m going to assume you saw me mention that Stalinism was not Communism in its ideal form, but was a Stalinist form.

Your point is thus not about Communism, but about Communism under Authoritarian leaders… And I have already shown that Capitalism is capable of mass killings and atrocities under all sorts of conditions as part of the philosophy (ingrained to it). Where as Stalin’s actions here aren’t specifically connected to Communist doctrine. I’ve already covered this point several times with the previous respondant.

That there is a written philosophy - that of Marxism, that of the Communes and the Commons, is why I can say these things. It has a primary set of writings. But we can say that about Capitalism too…

That’s because real capitalism hasn’t been tried yet. All the capitalist systems still had subsidies, governments beyond enforcing property law, …

…because Marx was ALSO the person who first defined and wrote about CapitalISM, in his work DAS KAPITAL 1867.

You can look and find commentaries about other concepts in different languages and different sounding words that aren’t Capitalism, such as Merchantilism, or in The Hollantse, or you can find the word Capital here and there and claim it relates, or instance around the time of Marx’s first treatise on the subject, but none are systematic, focused on the right topic using the ism repeatedly and providing a widely agreed in definition of it.

Like all concepts it has these forerunners that are related but NOT it. So you have tried to be clever here without realizing that when we discuss Capitalism in the way I have - we are talking about Marx’s original definition of it. Which was the phenomena of using an unearned accumulation of KAPITAL in order to purchase, own, and exploit workers for the purposes of profiting from exploiting their now alienated Labor.

No, because that was not real capitalism.

Oh yes, as you can read above, it very much is. It is in its original description as found in the criticism by Karl Marx in Das Kapital, in 1867. A description so accurate that it’s widely agreed with - even among the Capitalists. He was the first and primary text on what the doctrine of “real Capitalism” is. Capitalists hitherto didn’t want what they were doing to be known so openly, and intimately and for good reason. Just as any abuser doesn’t want what they’re doing to be described. It comes naturally to them, and that is no excuse for it, doesn’t make it more moral or acceptable. Only once it’s pointed out accurately described does the argument start, only then can the behaviours meet reforms. Which is why in Marx’s writings we also find advocacy for labor rights.

Sorry my friend, but what I’ve spoken about is indeed, Real Capitalism™ - down to the origin of the term.

P.S there’s also Proudhon: the capitalist’s employee was “subordinated, exploited: his permanent condition is one of obedience” - so not much better. People of the era were writing things as they saw them emerge. It’s still the problem of the abuser as described above.

What’s embarrassing was seeing lemny try to censor commentary and discussion of events whilst reddit just let things rip.

I thought this was the free speech platform but reddit put this place to shame. What a let down.

Isn’t there a big union that aligned it’s general meeting with something… I forget what year that’s set to happen. Supposed to open the possibility of a massive general strike.

2028, just in case Trump doesn’t leave office:

https://www.thenation.com/article/activism/general-strike-2028-unions-labor-movement/

Part of why Lemmy can federate and why they’re so innovative is because they’re not stored in a traditional server space, instead, theyre run on old Bitcoin graphics cards . Some of which AMD 600 - 1000 series, are supposedly easier to network and run in parallel, so when I talk about AMD Lemmy, I mean using thise parts of Lemmy as a bridge, or network gateway to Threads.

I love how this is painted as hacking when the root cause is an unrestricted number of telco subsideries that pay for access to the system, this then essentially gives them the powers and credentials to monitor, intercept, and clone anyone’s phone and send/receive their messages/calls (Linus Tech Tips teamed up with Derek from Veritasium to show the extent to which it can be done, stealing his identity to intercept texts to and from his wife).

This is a product of the market deregulations of Capitalism. Capitalism is once again a security risk to citizens of free democracies. Shit happens all the time.

People say China represses free speech, but at least there they recognize the repression and have a rich lexicon of codewords to get around it already.

The shaping of the western mind has been much more subtle and total that few even accept that it’s happened.

BlueSky seems like an obviously better fit. The more corporate interests are protected on and by Lemmy the less interesting it is…

…and plaves like c/News are already there to mostly protect and defend corporate interests.

Whilst it was done in the name of Siberians, it happened in Bosnia.

Depends on how far away the civil war is.

Turns out mainstream journalism, news agencies, and even forums that deliver “the news” are actually there to force a particular cultural interpretation of the news whilst preventing others. We can see this in the sane washing of Trump.

It’s another aspect of cultural Class Warfare - The Frankfurt School pointed it out in this essay. They called it “The Culture Industry”, and Marcuse said it was an inescapable part of the reproduction of culture in the age of “mechanical reproduction”… Which is what Marcuse’ book “One Dimensional Man” is about.

Of course the millionaires and billionaires who fund the news and social media don’t want anyone seeing a certain kind of justice in the death of one of their own. Even if it’s really a byproduct of a system (techno feudalism) that really offers no other pathway to justice.

Russia is getting really low on tanks.

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No, you’re measuring perceived deficits of “Communism” based on what you think about Stalinism (which is not the same thing). Technically Communism or “Scientific Socialism” would have used science to test various techniques of growing crops than selected the best (roughly what happened in Vietnamese Communism).

But Stalinism is called Stalinism because it’s not exactly faithful to Communism as a philosophy.

But yes there are plenty example of profit driven systems of Capitalism creating starvation famines ect. Whether it be the East India Company, or the leveraged loans of the World Banks in Africa, or the effects of Climate change, when combined they have a far greater death toll than Communism.

…and you had/have genocides and gulag style systems of punishment in Capitalism as well, whether it’s the workhouses of Ireland in the past century (with their mass graves of Children), Prison Labour in the US, or the blood mining and rare minerals in Africa… Hell Capitalism has set machine guns on workers before in South Africa. Even America has things like the Battle of Blair Mountain and the Ludowlow worker massacre in its history (where mine security had a license to r*pe the wives of workers).

You’re just not taught about these things. I can provide you references for any fact I give you here. Just ask.

So whilst you think I’m ignoring the ills of Communism (or it’s Stalinist incarnation), which I’m not. I think you’re being totally blind of the fact Capitalism has a far greater death toll, and other detriments to the world you’re purposefully overlooking, or just ignorant of.

PFAs, Bisphenol A, micro plastics in fetuses, thalidomide, the military industrial complex, the wars of the banana Republics (placing them under corporate tyranny), Pinochet, the list is infinite because it’s ongoing.

… and here there I’ll make this point: Atleast Communism refines its practice and goals, it has progressively become less brutal as it refined its understanding of agriculture and to be VERY CLEAR that’s where the greatest number of deaths associated it come from, not as an intended or desire outcome but by accident.

The same cannot be said for the stagnation and purposeful creation of sufferings under Capitalism, from the minor wage slaveries and wage theft, to union busting (CokeCola even going as far as to kill union organizers in Latin America), to the Triangle Shirtwaist fire (where as with many factory fires, workers were locked in so their pockets could be checked for stolen sewing equipment), to more major things like mining strikes, or the awareness Exxon had around climate change in the 1960s, or Phillip Morris had about causing addiction, cancer, and fatalities.

Sorry, but in reality Capitalism has caused more suffering, in a more substantial and intentional way, that’s more connected to the Capitalist doctrine of profit making and wage minimization, than Communism ever has.

Even today America essentially has had its democracy usurped by Capitalist Oligarchs (Musk, Thiel, Andresseen).

You’d have to be absolutely blind to ignore all this history, all this connectedness to the doctrine, the purposes of profit and hence exploitation, and all that continues to this very day.

Without a doubt Capitalism is responsible for everything I’ve spoken about here, and it has within it no means, or even the suggestion of being a reformist system. Communism does and has made meaningful reforms and strides in the short periods it exists in. Which is why places like China, and Vietnam have made the strides they have, and why Americans visit Cuba for healthcare.

What I’ve said here, you cannot deny. Like I say, I can provide sources for all of it.

P.S Just to clarify China and Vietnam have Socialist Oriented Market Economies, Vietnam is probably the closest to a Marxist Socialism as its internal tension are mediated through giant Social Union movements that go far beyond just representing workers, there is a national union just for women, one for disabled people, one for students ect. They all have a voice/power capable of directing how the party forms policies and directs resources.

So you’re saying with enough checks and balances that distribute power widely enough through legal offices and separations of power, some sort of democratic socialism would in theory be possible (assuming a peaceful transition via pre-deternend legislative changes were in place and ready to be followed)?

It’s really not. It’s mostly nepotism and reproducing the an untouchable ruling class that creates an autocracy. Put simply; when one system goes too far into autocracy, you should entertain the values of another system.

Condemning that is approving of the current autocrats. But perhaps you’re a particular fan of Trump/Musk.

True, but when one system becomes sufficiently crushing, it’s best to popularize an alternative so the guy in the boot has to focus on other things for a moment.

If the boot changes colour and doctrine, and becomes crushing again, I’ll happily advocate for a free market system to distract him again…

Or perhaps some third system such as a mix of communitarianism, distributism, and Georgism. I’m not going to be particularly ideological in this.

…and the Truth is we’re speeding towards a techno-feudalism (it’s no longer Capitalism when places like Amazon dictate prices and promotions to both producers/sellers and consumers/buyers, that’s not Capitalism anymore), so unless you like licking that particular boot, your noted point may not actually serve anything than a heavier foot.