Keep punching left I’m sure you’ll win over those moderate Republicans any day now /s
Well this didn’t age well.
Hopefully we will learn to not blame people for their choice but just try to offer them something better.
In other words.
You can stuff their heads with memes and talking-points all day, get them shouting the party slogans in chorus.
But you can’t give them the initiative to actually do something.
(Or to think for themselves for that matter. It rather contradicts the whole stuffed-head thing)
Yeah, punch left some more. Seems to work really well for you guys.
Yeah lets blame the voters, not the candidates for not exciting the voter base with actual solutions for issues
If the threat of your neighbors, everyone in Gaza and the West Bank and Lebanon and in Taiwan and Ukraine being killed while worsening the climate crisis and plunging over 300 million into fascism isn’t “exciting” to voters, then those voters are sociopaths.
Most Americans are extraordinarily ignorant of anything outside of america. Shit a lot of people dont even know the war in Ukraine is still raging. The only thing they can really see is the cost of living, and we suffered terribly under biden.
Theres a video by britmonkey explaining how Americans became so ignorant
Can’t wait for Trump to make that worse.
I’d have taken “not making abortion illegal nation wide” but I guess even that was too little for many.
I honestly think people just don’t realize how much worse it can get. We all get to see together now.
not making abortion illegal nation wide
Didn’t we just have a four year democratic regime? What happened? Did they just forget? On Jan 6th, will Biden go “oh shoot! We were supposed to do something about abortion rights! Ah well, next presidency.”
How do you think laws are made? There were bills and they got filibustered. Blame Joe Manchin for keeping the filibuster and blocking his entire party from passing it.
How is US law made?
The same way regardless of whether the democrats or the republicans are in power.
Ok, are you under the impression Dems would get help passing this abortion protection bill from Republicans?
You must realize that you have kind of an inconsistent view of the efficacy of the oval office. When the republicans are in power, or are about to be, this is something to be feared, and they’ll turn the country into a banana republic, and they’ll curtail all civil rights. But when a democratic is in power, the presidency becomes this meaningless ceremonial role that can’t really do anything because of those darned republicans, and so you can’t really blame them for not making any meaningful change. This is clearly internally inconsistent. One of these two opinions is false. Either the presidency can be used to effect meaningful change, or it cannot. You can’t believe both.
I think the republicans show that the former is true. Whether you like it or not (I certainly don’t), whenever the republicans are in power they’re able to enact massive impactful changes (the changes which eventually led to the overturning of Roe v Wade are a good example). The reasons as to why the democrats do not enact such changes is up for debate, but the idea that they don’t because they can’t is demonstrably false.
This is a long-winded non answer.
How do Dems pass abortion protection laws without overwhelming control of the House, Senate, and Presidency?
It’s not inconsistent. We see it habitually. Republican power is oversized in the Senate, House, and arguably the Executive due to structural issues caused by our bicameral system and the cap on representatives. This results in the GOP having a much stronger majority control over all three branches - added also that Republican politicians toe the line more frequently for the radical things they want to push.
It isn’t an objective matter of how powerful or effective the Executive branch is, but also the power structures in the party in control. It is not a false dichotomy to think that Democrats struggle to pass impactful changes while on power, but the Republicans are able to do that more effectively while in power.
Unironically this.
There “anti-electoralist leftists” are nearly undisguisable from those nihilistic radical centrists, except one likes to LARP as the Stalinist secret police.
And frankly, even if you’re literally portioning rations for the revolution you plan to start tomorrow, the idea of not taking the absolutely minute amount of time, in the grand scheme of things, that it takes to potentially positively affect change is still absurd. If this really was the revolution, then the people’s army couldn’t afford to leave strategic advantages like that on the table.
Somebody said something to this effect once: Voting isn’t about picking which hero is going to save us; it’s about picking the kind of villain we have to fight against.
I just don’t even understand how this is still a conversation. It’s literally not an either/or dichotomy here. All of those things you want to do to prepare for the revolution or whatever? You can still do all of them and vote. You lose absolutely nothing by voting. Zero. It’s just such a batshit mentality from the very onset.
After really trying to engage sincerely with a couple of these folks online the only conclusion I can reach is that they are trying to suppress the vote under the guise of being extremist left. Like you say, there’s zero rational strategy to not using or tanking your vote, and only can be defended if you claim both candidates are the same. They persist in saying that, with trash like “Revolution is necessary, electoralism cannot work.” to rationalize not voting toward the lesser of two evils.
“Anarchists against electoralism” is a tiny number of people the Dems like to scapegoat. The vast majority of voters don’t even know Anarchists exist.
Unfortunately, most people are checked out of “politics”. I wish Democrats were more focused on reaching out and getting people excited to vote, rather than the constant complaints about people to the left of you.
Exactly this. I think there are only two people you hear saying this: the overtly bad actors trying to suppress votes or the few extremely gullible idiots who stupidly get wrapped up in the lies of former. Thankfully I think it’s usually clear before long which of the two you’re talking to and only one of them is worth your time, and they’re the rarer of them.
All of those things you want to do to prepare for the revolution or whatever? You can still do all of them and vote.
I mean, a few of the things I want to do to prepare for a revolution are explicitly illegal, and I don’t have enough commas in my bank account to get away with treason.
And this has any relevancy on voting… How? Either you’re going to the do the illegal things, which can be done on any day other than Nov 5 or you aren’t going to the do the illegal things and you can still vote on Nov 5.
I don’t give a shit about your personal revolutionary savior cosplaying fantasy; it is entirely non-sequitur to the topic of how voting is still the reasonable choice even for the revolutionarily-motivated.
I’m not going to vote on November 5th.
Because I mailed my ballot on October 23rd.
Your masturbatory revolutionary cosplay fantasies are still non-sequitur nonetheless.
Yes, it was an attempt at a joke. Hence me saying I don’t have enough commas
Guess today’s not the day for jokes.
Today is the day we need jokes the most.
I know a guy who was working for the Fire Department in New York on 9/11/2001.
He told me that when he brought a newspaper on 9/12 he was disappointed that they’d cut the comics page.
He said it was a day he really needed to see Charlie Brown and Lucy.
Guess I need better jokes then
Canonical Strawman Leftist™ describing their utopia: “Everyone votes on everything, and we engage in thoughtful discussion to persuade our neighbors to make good choices with their votes.”
Same leftist describing today: “Voting is pointless, and it’s impossible to change anyone’s mind.”
It’s nice of you to admit you’re arguing against a straw man.
Do you know how much fuckin time that would take? I’m glad we hire people to do these things. I just wish they were better at them.
The burden of proof is on revolutionaries. Always!
You not only need to show that your radically new society is a genuine improvement (and won’t collapse into a brutal dictatorship) but also that it’s enough of an improvement to be worth the millions of lives that would be lost during the revolution! Furthermore, you need to show that the new society you propose can accommodate people whose ideology is different from your own.
Assuming that humans will all think and behave the same way has never worked throughout human history. Liberal democracy (and to a lesser extent enlightened monarchy) has been the only time period to accommodate diverse opinions, scientific and economic flourishing, and strong protections for individual liberty (and sexuality) simultaneously with a large population. All of the other systems were either very small (and so relied on the close bonds of kinship and inter-familial relationships) or dominated by brutal despots.
Thus, as much as we hate our current system for its many flaws, it’s so much better than everything that has gone before that the bar has been set very high.
LMFAO OP just tearing through the haters in the comments
Wow I literally just watched this episode
I dislike leftist Seinfeld, even if he’d hate it.
Genuinely laughing at how you construct a false premise and then continue building a mountain of straw men on top of it.
I guess that’s what happens when liberals abandon reality. Better luck constructing a coherent thought next time!
Genuinely laughing at how you construct a false premise and then continue building a mountain of straw men on top of it.
I guess that’s what happens when liberals abandon reality. Better luck constructing a coherent thought next time!
>You’re absolutely right. Most of these self-proclaimed leftists don’t even pretend to have any clue how to start a revolution, whilst demanding it as the only possible course of action.
Tbf, they’re mostly well aware that they’re too few in number to violently overthrow the system. So the opening of the OP is a bit of a strawman
Otoh they watch people looting an electronics store on tv and interpret it as ‘something is brewing’
There absolutely are folks precisely what the OP is talking about. One verbatim quote from an exchange I had: “Revolution is necessary, electoralism cannot work.”
He was absolutely adamant that voting is stupid and people shouldn’t bother because we need “true communism” that cannot come from voting.
Genuinely laughing is against the code of conduct.
-10,000 social credit 🤡
True leftism is when you blindly vote lib, support capitalism, and obey the wealthy like a good puppy
There is no vote this election that will result in a better system. I’m not even sure there’s a vote that won’t result in a worse one.
Stein
People were saying the same about Biden and look at all the stuff he did. Green energy, ira, drug price controls, chips act, etc. So yes voting Dems will give you a better system.
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I was living in Germany in '88-'89 when the wall came down. You got me, I’m just out here destabilizing countries for hire. Actually I’m just an American who has lived in righty places and lefty places and it’s made me a proponent of ranked choice voting. I think we get railroaded into a choice between two shit shows every year.
Weird you say no vote will result in a better system, and then claim to be a proponent of ranked choice voting. Which just happens to be on the ballot for at least one state.
So which is it?
Quick question, which places in USA have ranked choice voting and how many of those places are ‘lefty’ places?
There are a few but I’d have to look it up just like you. But I have lived in Portland, San Francisco, Minneapolis, Duesseldorf, Seattle. The ranked choice opinion comes from being someone who reads a lot and is generally anti-authoritarian. The US has two authoritarian parties.
There are a few but I’d have to look it up just like you.
Also look up which places have banned RCV and which political party is in power there.
The US has two authoritarian parties.
If you honestly believe that then you’re a dumbass.
I’d argue if you don’t believe it you are.
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